Forums

Re: Precision vs. Forgiveness

• JasCooper 528 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 8:01 AM

  Got a nice driver and now a decent putter (thanks to 2 credits at a time video because I'm cheap). 

  Looking over the charts one of my biggest confusions is how much difference each step makes for each characteristic. And which characteristics are most important. 

  For example, do I want more forgiveness or more precision? Can forgiveness actually be bad? If I want to hook or fade a shot to counter the wind or get around a bunker, would I actually want less forgiveness (i.e. Will a shot early or late not do what I want)? 

  And how much does a .5 step do? TaylorMade has three sets for 795, 1295 and 1400 credits. Same precision but varying forgiveness and meter speed. I know folks say to match the meter speed of my clubs, but I just like as much as I can get. So is it worth 500 more credits to bump meter speed to 4.5 from 3, yet take a .5 drop in forgiveness and get a bit more spin?

  Then, when I get into wedges, since I'm closer to the hole does missing the mark on the meter make less difference? I seem to have more problem getting my distances right than aim. 

  TIA for answers to any or all these questions.

• jessek12 102 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 10:03 AM

  I'm sure one of the vets on here will have better info, but in short (and my opinion), precision is better than forgiveness unless you really struggle with hitting the ding. Precision is basically "does the ball go where you aimed if you ding", so if you are pretty close to the ding, your shots should be pretty predictable. However, if you miss the ding and don't have forgiveness, all bets are off.

  Yes, too much forgiveness will make it harder to work the ball side to side, but the need to do this is (again, my opinion) somewhat limited.

  Not sure on the exact qualitative difference between 2 and 2.5, or 2.5 and 3 other than 0.5% (obviously). In your TM case, I would say it's definitely worth the 500 credits. Slower meter speed means you probably won't need much forgiveness since you'll be dinging more shots, and the increased spin will help balls stop better.

  Wedges, I think precision is key. They usually have decent meter speeds, so you should be pretty close to dinging them and you definitely want your wedges as precise as possible. Can't tell you how frustrating it would be to think you hit a great shot but end up 6 yds from the pin due to low precision.

  Hope this helps, sorry for length

  - Jesse

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 10:47 AM

  Good explanation by Jesse. This thread explains in detail about precision and forgiveness.

• borntobesting 9,709 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 11:18 AM

  Actually if you hit the ding more often than not or your miss dings are near dings then precision is the main thing you want. But on the other hand if you miss the ding quite often and miss it by a lot then forgiveness is king.

• JasCooper 528 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 3:16 PM

  Looking at Jesse's link he seems to infer that precision affects accuracy right or left of the mark and forgiveness relates to distance. I can see how precision would apply that way but wouldn't forgiveness apply to both distance and direction?

  For the sake of example, let's say there's no wind and flat ground. Is the distance given for a particular club the distance the ball will touch ground before rolling?

  Then, does elevation move that distance forward or backward along the arc that the ball travels. I.e. Higher elevation means shorter travel, and lower means farther travel. So drivers would have more variance. And iron/wedges decreasing amounts the greater the angle?

  I tried to open the link with the wind calculator but couldn't (I'm on an iPad and don't think I can open .zip files). 

  Are there documents which go into some of the calculations WGT uses? Like when does how far off the ding does a hook or fade become just a very inaccurate shot? Or how much distance is lost if a shot is away from the ding but within the marks to either side?

  Thanks for all the help. I'd like to get better at this game.

   

  Now that my expensive balls wore out, I'm beginning to wonder if the balls costing a few hundred credits aren't worth the investment to get more distance, spin, and slower meter. Especially with clubs that don't have good meter speed or forgiveness. I wish you could get them with unlimited durability.

  Although I guess WGT wants you do pony up some bucks instead of running 2 point videos for hours at a time. 

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 4:38 PM

  JasCooper:

  For the sake of example, let's say there's no wind and flat ground. Is the distance given for a particular club the distance the ball will touch ground before rolling?

  No. You have to learn that yourself and it's called carry. Many things affect this carry-spin, wind, elevation, club attributes, proximity to the ding  and balls. Finding irons you like and a ball to go with them is key. Then you learn what the carry is with your combination and stick with it. High lofted irons are best.

  On elevations, you have that right but there isn't an exact formula for computing it. The best thing you can do to get an estimate would be to convert the elevation to yards and add or subtract that from the distance.

  JasCooper:

  Are there documents which go into some of the calculations WGT uses?

  A lot of players have developed their own. I'm sure you'll see some help there but you need to be careful about expecting 2+2 to equal 4. Gamers do that and get frustrated. If you're a real golfer, play this game the same way. Learn your clubs, use all the shots and be smart. It's hugely rewarding, IMO.  :-)

• JFidanza 1,676 Posts

  Fri, Jun 10 2016 4:47 PM

  JasCooper:

   If I want to hook or fade a shot to counter the wind or get around a bunker

  The hook or fade physics are not programmed in WGT irons or wedges.

   

  http://www.wgt.com/forums/p/237339/1719905.aspx#1719905

   

• alosso 21,072 Posts

  Sat, Jun 11 2016 12:16 AM

  JasCooper:

  Looking at Jesse's link he seems to infer that precision affects accuracy right or left of the mark and forgiveness relates to distance.

  Both to both me thinks. Some analogy pictures say precision is the circle your balls will end up when hitting several perfect shots ("excellent", "ding"), and forgiveness is the area where shots end when missing the ding. Most of the latter shots will stay short and stray left or right...

  JasCooper:

  Then, does elevation move that distance forward or backward along the arc that the ball travels. I.e. Higher elevation means shorter travel, and lower means farther travel. So drivers would have more variance. And iron/wedges decreasing amounts the greater the angle?

  True, and here the trajectory has an effect. Good clubs may need the common "yards for feet" adjustment, low clubs like the Starters may need "club for some feet" adaption.

  There are no official documents, but experience will get you along. Concerning "fade" and "draw", you may go just outside the next marks for acceptable results.

  JasCooper:

  Now that my expensive balls wore out, I'm beginning to wonder if the balls costing a few hundred credits aren't worth the investment to get more distance, spin, and slower meter. Especially with clubs that don't have good meter speed or forgiveness.

  Custom balls have a life of 100-120 shots (excluding putts from the greens), and get lost in water and OOB. Mulligans cost extra. You better balance the quality of balls and clubs because high priced balls are wasted with low clubs (No jugement on the COIN clubs available).

  My two Pfennig: Try balls from low to high, e.g. B-ES, Tour-SD. Hold back Srixon, Callaway L33 and so forth for better clubs.

  No difference in the value of "free" credits and bought credits, though they say that we get less ads when buying. When going the "free" way, players have to become used to the feeling of getting scammed though.