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New Courses - Suggestion

Thu, Aug 11 2016 11:22 AM (68 replies)
  • ApexPC
    3,164 Posts
    Mon, Nov 11 2013 5:35 PM

    'Revenue' is the gross amount taken in. The expenses needed to operate the business get paid out of that revenue.

    If revenue exceeds expenses, the business makes a profit.

    A big business expense is payroll, employee benefits, and state unemployment insurance. Another expense WGT would have is paying the use licensing fees to all the golf courses they already have for us to play.

    Advertising is another big expense.

    The cost to add a course has to be paid from previously made profits.

  • alanti
    10,564 Posts
    Tue, Nov 12 2013 12:16 AM

    thebigeasy707:
    Their butt is so tight it squeaks when they walk.

    TVM TBE - I spat my coffee over my screen!

    I agree there are hundreds of courses from all over the globe that would (and supposedly want) love the exposure WGT could give. However Apex is 100% right not all courses want this - mine (a championship course) 95% of the members would be dead against it - and thats why we pay exorbitant annual fees for the exclusivity).

    thebigeasy707:

    Would be better if they plugged the MLB hole everyone spending $$ on here is subsidising and put more money, effort and emphasis back into this game. Maybe it's just a coincidence the 2nd HD course/year vanished around the time WGT Baseball came into being. I don't believe in coincidences. Things happen for a reason.

    And this is the reason for the slowdown IMO, no other reason and Bandon Dunes and Best Ofs have been (or will be) added just to try and appease the peasants.

    AS TBE pointed out the increase in prices of equipment, but to me it is very evident that advertising on the site has also increased dramatically. So I do not buy the theory that expenditure exceeds turnover. After all,staffing has only increased marginally (and judging by the long term bugs that never get fixed), the programmers are paid peanuts or they are the rejects no-one else will employ.

    I believe that every business (and branches of that business) should be accountable for their own performance and certainly do not believe in subsidizing a part of the business that is failing - aka Baseball.

     

  • thebigeasy707
    5,885 Posts
    Tue, Nov 12 2013 7:56 AM

     

    ApexPC:

    'Revenue' is the gross amount taken in. The expenses needed to operate the business get paid out of that revenue.

    If revenue exceeds expenses, the business makes a profit.

    A big business expense is payroll, employee benefits, and state unemployment insurance. Another expense WGT would have is paying the use licensing fees to all the golf courses they already have for us to play.

    Advertising is another big expense.

    The cost to add a course has to be paid from previously made profits.

    Been running my own businesses (2 of them) very successfully for over 10 years now so don't need to know the business basics...thanks anyway.

    If you want to talk profit margins I''ll jump on the bus and travel along with you for a while at least.

    How much profit do you think WGT makes on pixel balls that cost $0 to produce but are sold for upto $6.50 a sleeve, or that pixel Odyssey putter which costs $40, or even the R11 irons. ? Then scale it by the 10's of 1000's of players who're constantly buying the $5 nikes and have the R1 / R11 drivers & R11 clubs, expensive wedges and putters and all the other extras. Then there's the commission WGT make from all the RG's, Skins & MPC's etc.  It all adds up to a very tidy sum indeed. Lots of profit from stuff that costs virtually $0 whatsoever after the initial start up cost of the graphics, course productions and programmers has been met etc.

    There's been over 10 millions rounds played to date.

    Remembering that the Forbes mag quoted the $40-$50 million with the cheaper end equipment.

    Anyone who actually believes that WGT would even come remotely close to struggling to roll out 2HD courses per year is living in cloud cuckooland.

    Like I said, I'm not here to bash WGT but there's a reason for something sucking the $$$ out of this game and it ain't the running costs, staff costs or licensing fees of this game.

    Of course WGT have the right to run their business their way, whether we see it as right or wrong, it changes nothing.

    alanti:
    I believe that every business (and branches of that business) should be accountable for their own performance and certainly do not believe in subsidizing a part of the business that is failing - aka Baseball.

    ditto m8

     

  • JasonNumber100
    2,909 Posts
    Tue, Nov 12 2013 11:01 AM

    How can you say that pixel balls cost nothing to make. You think they just appear by magic. There will be a cost involved to use branded names on the balls and then they have to be programmed to react like the real thing. Just because it's virtual does not mean there is no cost involved.

    None of us know all the costs involved. You say $40-$50 million which is highlighted in the media. That doesn't tell the whole story. Remember they are a business and their goal is to make money.

    Prices only reflect the market, if they are too high customers won't pay. That's how a free market works. If you don't like it, don't pay.

  • thebigeasy707
    5,885 Posts
    Tue, Nov 12 2013 2:40 PM

    JasonNumber100:
    How can you say that pixel balls cost nothing to make. You think they just appear by magic.

    Takes a designer minutes to make a golf ball vector from scratch and stick a logo on it. Don't know how much WGT pay but I'd gladly design the next ball for less than $10, then gift someone a few sleeves of balls with the money. So on that note, less than $10 for a ball that WGT can replicate a million times over and sell on for $5 a sleeve makes the initial design cost  relatively negligible.

    JasonNumber100:
    There will be a cost involved to use branded names on the balls
    Who says there's a cost. Nike and Callaway will also be enjoying huge sales of their balls due to WGT advertising their brand, so there's nothing to say Nike or Callaway could actually be paying WGT to put their logos on the balls....we'll never know.

    JasonNumber100:
    and then they have to be programmed to react like the real thing

    Will be a doddle and take no time at all for any programmer to get right, considering they'll have the source codes for the other balls to work with and gauge distance / backspin / durability on any new ones.....and again peanuts with regards to any cost involved.

    Forgot to say, my main line of business is graphic design / web design / programming etc. Been in it just over 10 years, so I understand it well enough.

    All I am saying is that WGT can more than afford to roll out 2 decent HD courses per year like they used to when equipment and balls were $5 a driver and $1.75 for a sleeve of balls.

    Nowadays the avg player uses $3 Callaways & $5 Nikes, decent drivers cost $25, putters at $25 and sets of clubs for $30, so surely anyone with 1/2 a brain can understand that, yes WGT is a business, yes it's in it to make money bla bla.....BUT they could also afford to roll out 2 decent HD courses a year because they're making far more profit today than they were making by selling $5 drivers and cheap end rock balls.

    JasonNumber100:
    None of us know all the costs involved.

    That's correct.....none of us know all the costs involved but I'm willing to bet we'd all get a shock if we were told lol.

    JasonNumber100:
    You say $40-$50 million which is highlighted in the media. That doesn't tell the whole story

    Correct again, that doesn't tell us the whole story.....in fact WGT refrained from disclosing the actual amount, which generally means it was more. :)

    I'm not here to bash WGT, of course it's their business but it's worth pointing out that there is a new game on the horizon, when it does get off the ground and is as good as it looks & where new courses can be developed in next to no time, then WGT is going to have some stiff competition and needs to buckle up that is unless you actually believe people will remain and sit tight for the US Open every year, whilst there's 9 or 10 courses a year getting rolled out over yonder.

    JasonNumber100:
    That's how a free market works. If you don't like it, don't pay.

    Who's quibbling about paying? Not me, I've paid since day one. Many $1000's actually because I'd rather spend some free cash than mess around with the freebie route as my time is more important to me than money.

  • AGArgent
    343 Posts
    Wed, Nov 13 2013 8:31 AM

    thebigeasy707:

    JasonNumber100:
    If we get the US Open course next year then I'll be happy.

    You'll be happy for many years then cause the US Open's the only fkn HD course we seem to get year in year out lol.

    How about WGT go and photograph a course outside of the USA....it's meant to be World Golf Tour after all.

    I'm well aware of how much time, effort and money goes into producing a new course but as WGT's turnover is in excess of $50 million (they won't actually disclose the real figure as stated in Forbes magazine).... it may just be possible for them to squeeze in another HD course yathink?

    From Forbes last year....

    The majority of the company’s $40 million to $50 million in revenue (WGT won’t disclose figures) comes from online tournament fees and sales of virtual goods to players. A new set of clubs can cost $14 in credits. A Lynx LX5 driver costs $2.

    Truth is WGT would rather rake in the candy and let folks stomach one decent new HD course a year now.

    WGT have saved $$ for two years now because of their inability to get the British Open and on that note, they've also ignored any Plan B in an effort to offer us a replacement.

    When the dearest balls were $2.75 we were getting 2 HD course a year. Now balls can cost upto $6.50 and clubs are far more expensive......so how come there's only been the US Open for the last couple of years...........go figure!

    I'm not here to bash WGT. It's a great game but they should stop being such tightwads and get the wallet out. Their butt is so tight it squeaks when they walk.

    Donald Trump came over to Scotland to build the world's greatest course (his words not mine). Maybe WGT should follow his lead and roam further afield than the USA each year. Tons of decent courses in Australia, Europe and generally East of New York heading across the Atlantic.

    One thing's for sure......it ain't for the lack of money that WGT hangs on one decent HD course per year nowadays.

    Would be better if they plugged the MLB hole everyone spending $$ on here is subsidising and put more money, effort and emphasis back into this game. Maybe it's just a coincidence the 2nd HD course/year vanished around the time WGT Baseball came into being. I don't believe in coincidences. Things happen for a reason.

    Just telling it like it is......

    OK rant over.

    +2

  • ApexPC
    3,164 Posts
    Wed, Nov 13 2013 11:43 AM

    thebigeasy707:

    How much profit do you think WGT makes on pixel balls that cost $0 to produce but are sold for up to $6.50 a sleeve, 

    I have no idea, but I'm pretty sure it costs them considerably more than $0 to have balls and all the other gear available for sale here on the web site even though they are virtual items.

    The behavior of each has to be programmed, the product descriptions have to be written and coded on a web page, and WGT has to pay licensing fees to the gear makers.

     

  • thebigeasy707
    5,885 Posts
    Wed, Nov 13 2013 1:52 PM

    ApexPC:
    WGT has to pay licensing fees to the gear makers.

    how do you know?

    it's also quite possible that Nike, Callaway and all the other equipment makers actually pay WGT for advertising their brands.....which is maybe why we don't see Titleist pro V's on here because Titleist either won't pay or won't to pay enough.

    i'd say that WGT has more to offer in the way of advertising to these companies than these companies have to offer WGT, so it would not surprise me in the slightest if WGT are getting paid to advertise these brands.....that's how clever minded advertising departments work and WGT are pretty sharp when it comes to money making ideas.

    another way to look at it is this.......why would wgt even want to pay Nike or Callaway a cent....when they produce their own branded equipment...and can make them with any specification or durability they want.....with or without a top branded logo. ?

    as for the equipment design etc, if you'd read my post above, you'd realise that the design / programming side isn't necessarily as expensive as many think. equipment gets designed / programmed once then sold a multi thousand times at decent prices....and WGT have a right to earn money.....no one disputes that.

    on a final note though, I'd also like add that WGT have been developing the game with respects to iphones / tablets and ipad2's, so of course I appreciate that there has been a decent outlay on those fronts.

    i'm outspoken with my views at times but be under no illusion......i want WGT to go forward with strength and keep this game the best online virtual golf for many years to come.

    i'd still like them to squeeze in 2 decent HD course a year. :)

    those who push for the extra courses have more chance of getting them than those who just sit back and accept stagnation.

    onwards and upwards...it's the only way.

    and whatever happened to the Chad TV podcasts? Q&A's ? ....there's not been one of those for a while.

  • Kurtsbuford
    7,592 Posts
    Thu, Nov 14 2013 6:03 AM

    GO WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

  • donsprintr
    2,063 Posts
    Thu, Nov 14 2013 8:28 AM

    Kurtsbuford:

    GO WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

    And let the speculation begin ....

    Oooops .... I see it already has ... :-)

     

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