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Conceding Should be Black and White

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Tue, Nov 24 2015 5:19 PM (53 replies)
  • PaulTon
    10,731 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 2:14 AM

    Tamsach:
    I wrote played by gentlemen, not invented. Bye

    No. You equated nobility with  gentlemanliness,a truly hilarious idea, read any country's history and you'll find that the 'nobility' were violent, duplicitous, immoral thieves and opportunists.

     In the country it was invented and developed golf was never (and still isn't) an elitist game.

    I don't actually think you're a dick, but your comments about Magneto were miles wide of the mark. He's not only one of the best to ever play this game, he is also one of the nicest guys to knock a ball around with.

    Edit - Just seen your p.s. The 1st sentence is so obvious it didn't need said. The 2nd one is for others to decide, not me, but like all men, I waver between being a gentleman and an utter dick. :)

  • fmagnets
    3,640 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 2:52 AM

    Tamsach:

     I was quite surprise when I played vs FMagnets and he told me that he never concedes. What the hell: you are already the strongest by miles, and you wanna also take advantage from potential unlucky events for yr adversary? I definitely decided that FMagnets is not a gentleman and neither a golf player, imho.

    Here is the match against Tamsach. You can see at 4m30s what I said about concessions and decide for yourselves if he is a truthful person.

  • Tamsach
    2,823 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 4:14 AM

    English is not my language, but "any putt that could be missed" means for me, any putt. Just a putt from 5 inches and below could not be missed, unless it happened to me with an enormous jump of the meter. At yr place, my answer should have been: " I agree" Who the hell determine which his the putt that can't be missed? You maybe are so able to remember any dots of any green, I don't, I could say, we don't, so a rule, a point of encounter, has to be fixed, imo. Otherwise the FACT is that you don't agree to concede putts.

  • PaulTon
    10,731 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 4:22 AM

    Tamsach:
    I was quite surprise when I played vs FMagnets and he told me that he never concedes.

    fmagnets:
    You can see at 7m20s what I said about concessions and decide for yourselves if he is a truthful person.

    Tamsach " Just to know, I use to concede only 2ft and under, unless an easy putt"

                       "Do you agree?"

    Magneto "ANY putt that could be missed, we should not concede. Mine was definitely   missable there - big break"

    Tamsach "OK"

     

    Robert Burns, Scotland's national poet:
     Ah, Tam! Ah, Tam! You will get what's coming!  In hell they will roast you like a herring!

    I think the bard has said it all!

    Tamsach:
    Who the hell determine which his the putt that can't be missed?

    Your opponent, by clicking yes or no.

  • ct690911
    7,205 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 4:29 AM

    sue333318:

    SoKoSteve:

    sue333318:

    I never expect a concede and only give them when I feel fit, to concede from 3ft!!!!   Off the tee at the next?

    Time for the op to get real

    Think you missed the briefing, cupcake.

     

    Let me put it as simply as possible:

    a) I consider 3ft and under concedes unless my opponent thinks otherwise; (and I'm fine with that)

    b) My opponent thought otherwise;

    c) I didn't concede anything there on out and he missed a couple very short putts (one was wonky, but I would have conceded it anyhow) and he was angry about it.

    d) I won because he missed two gimmees that would have otherwise been conceded because he decided that was the way he wanted to play

    Some think that 3ft is good unless it's wonky (#9 at Oakmont, #1 side putt at Merion), but I feel that 3ft and in at all times is gentlemanly and takes away any chance of a miss from a meter or hole glitch.  Others disagree, as did my opponent, and I'm fine with that; live by the sword, die by the sword.

    Got it?  Now get real.

    S.

     

    Thanks so much for the insight Doughnut, I'm sure I have much to learn form your undoubted wisdom.

    Cupcake

    Aww...dats cute...doughnut and cupcake...:)

  • DDRoss1
    1,809 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 5:19 AM

    I have actually had what i thought was a friend drop me as a friend for missing cedes in alt for a 3.3 and 3. 7 ft putt....i was busy reading emails and some posts in skype, it was not even intentional, when did this stop being a game and life or death in alt shot, and 2 putt hits on a ball wont kill anyone.....wow....ps i you like to play alt, i need more alt friends, as i dont have many that play so please hit me up and i will try to remember to cede that 3.5 ft putt for you...lol..no really hit me up with an FR....i love to play alt, just most of my friends are more stroke players.

  • PaulTon
    10,731 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 6:00 AM

    DDRoss1:
    I have actually had what i thought was a friend drop me as a friend for missing cedes in alt for a 3.3 and 3. 7 ft putt

    If my friends did that I'd have none left, as you well know DD!!

    When it's not my turn I'm usually staring at faces in the clouds or looking for aliens/bigfoot.

    I smoke way too much...

  • ct690911
    7,205 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 6:06 AM

    DDRoss1:

    I have actually had what i thought was a friend drop me as a friend for missing cedes in alt for a 3.3 and 3. 7 ft putt....i was busy reading emails and some posts in skype, it was not even intentional, when did this stop being a game and life or death in alt shot, and 2 putt hits on a ball wont kill anyone.....wow....ps i you like to play alt, i need more alt friends, as i dont have many that play so please hit me up and i will try to remember to cede that 3.5 ft putt for you...lol..no really hit me up with an FR....i love to play alt, just most of my friends are more stroke players.

    All I play is Alt...friend request sent.

    ps...I also friended Paul Ton...is that a deal breaker?...:)

  • Tamsach
    2,823 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 7:03 AM

    Golf Illustrated writer George Trevor finished the article by discussing the special importance of holing out in match play and the inner debate that players face when determining whether or not a putt should be conceded:

    “Refusal to concede a three-footer may be constructed as poor sportsmanship. It doesn’t seem right to burden a contestant with such a delicate decision. A sensitive golfer fears to be pilloried as a poor sport. He will lean over backwards in conceding missable putts rather than have his sportsmanship questioned. Conceding putts may relieve course congestion and speed up play, but it also takes the joy out of life for the typical American golfer.” 

    ------

    The concession also seems imbued with a mythic grace, evidence of a certain spiritual nobility (I wrote it between " ", in Italy that means not the exact word but the surrounding ideal) of golf’s better self -- and ours, as well. Other sports do not have this kind of ritualized acquiescence, this prescribed displays of honor. There are no conceded field goals in football, no gimme home runs or penalty kicks. Everywhere else in the vast panoply of sport -- from darts to drag racing -- is a fight to the death by any means necessary. By most appearances, golf stands on a higher plane. And this sense of moral high ground runs true whether you are in your 30s or your 70s. Young Golf Digest veterans Max Adler and not-as-young Bob Carney think of the given putt in similar ways.

    Carney: "I have come to think that gentility is a virtue and what the sport is about. Sounds corny, but expecting or hoping to win based on someone else's misplay is less satisfying and also engenders weakness in oneself. Err on the side of the gimme. Gimme when you'd want someone to do the same for you.”

    Of course, the most notable example of that kind of gentility writ large in golf’s history is Jack Nicklaus’s gesture at the 1969 Ryder Cup. Nicklaus conceded a putt of relatively inconsequential length to Tony Jacklin to end the 1969 matches in a draw. It was noble and ultimately immaterial in that the tied matches meant the U.S. retained the Cup, but it spoke volumes about Nicklaus’ class. (I should add Tiger vs Molinari in 2012 Ryder )

    This is my idea of sport, notwithstanding some rude guys.

  • fmagnets
    3,640 Posts
    Tue, Nov 24 2015 8:08 AM

    Tamsach:

    English is not my language, but "any putt that could be missed" means for me, any putt.

    ....

    Otherwise the FACT is that you don't agree to concede putts.

    And as English is not your 1st language you shouldn't be adding your own (incorrect) interpretation to the English words that others use.

    Not agreeing to concede putts at a certain predetermined length in the semi-finals of the CC knockout competition is not the same as not agreeing to concede putts. If I know you have a bendy or false-breaking 2ft putt I may want to see it (especially at Merion on champ greens). If you have a straight 5ft putt I may decide it is unmissable and concede it, and have done in matches far more important than ours. The very article you cited talks about the art of deciding when and when not to give putts. Take this choice away and make it black and white and you are removing one of the facets of matchplay.

    I note that in our match you were conceded a 2.2ft putt because I considered it unmissable (the only time you were within 3ft).  I also note that the shortest putt not conceded was my 3ft putt on the first hole. The video shows that your statement "FMagnets told me that he never concedes" is untrue.

    And whilst I shouldn't have to add this, I will. Check out this video of the 15th green at Chambers Bay at 1h20m in arguably my biggest match of the year.

    As before when you tried to spread malicious lies about me, I await your apology with interest.

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