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We need a better product!!!

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Tue, Aug 4 2009 11:42 PM (25 replies)
  • HAWK64
    14 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:13 AM

    I would urge everyone not to purchase one more product until changes are made!!!

    1.  Fix the game; deviation shots are unfair especially when paying to play in a tournament

    2. Let us trade in old clubs

    3. Or a money back risk free trial period for any product we purchase, like in the real world.

    4. Allow a player up to 3 "play over" shots per 18 hole round.......meaning that deviation shots could be erased and replayed without penalty. 

    5. Or stop spoonfeeding us newer clubs with better specs, every couple of months.  We are spending too much money!!!! Just put all the products on the table once and for all with all the upgrades final.   Make a new club, in other words, but make the specs fully upgraded and final from the outset.

  • nivlac
    2,188 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:27 AM

    Deviations can easily be conquered.  Otherwise it'd be a rotating door on the top of the leaderboards.  Instead you see the same handful names on a consistent basis with the occasional random throwing up a good score.  If it wasn't for deviations, it would be the same 4 names every single week, guaranteed.  Back when deviations could be charted and predicted, that's exactly what happened.  The same 4 or 5 names.  Whether you believe it or not, deviations allow more players to win tournaments.

    Trade-ins are coming, that's been announced for a while.

    You don't get to replay shots in a real golf tournament.  In real golf, your shots don't always go where you expect them to, whether you think you hit them well or not.  You deal with it.  That's golf.

    It's a beta.  That's how it works.  They release little bits at a time. If you're not happy with how they are releasing things on their beta schedule, then I'd recommend coming back when the BETA is over.

  • Crusty56
    136 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:28 AM

    Can't do that.....it would kill the cash cow.

  • coolbluedavid
    34 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 9:45 AM

    this is not  like real golf...never will be.........

  • HAWK64
    14 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 1:17 PM

    Deviations can easily be conquered.  Otherwise it'd be a rotating door on the top of the leaderboards.  Instead you see the same handful names on a consistent basis with the occasional random throwing up a good score.  If it wasn't for deviations, it would be the same 4 names every single week, guaranteed.  Back when deviations could be charted and predicted, that's exactly what happened.  The same 4 or 5 names.  Whether you believe it or not, deviations allow more players to win tournaments.

    Wrong, but even if you were right, this is a poor excuse to allow deviations. You seem to indicate deviations are a big plan by WGT to keep the game fair.  Well, I never said anything about leaderboards.  Regardless, the game needs to be accurate.  Many like myself enjoy the game as a source of fun and are not here just for the leaderboards.  I would prefer that my shots fly straight.  The Tiers were put in place so that more people could win tournaments, and not some plan for deviations...how immature, if this is true.

    Trade-ins are coming, that's been announced for a while.

    Good, it's long overdue.

    You don't get to replay shots in a real golf tournament.  In real golf, your shots don't always go where you expect them to, whether you think you hit them well or not.  You deal with it.  That's golf.

    Wrong again.  In real life, when I hit a perfect shot, it assumes I did much right.  It does not mean the ball will go in the hole, of course,  but it sure as heck means I am not in a sand trap. Perfect means I hit sweet spot, my alignment was good, I released the club properly....ect.  "Perfect" means flawless and that includes the enitire swing not just making contact with the center of the club.  So I repeat, deviations need to be fixed on this game.

    It's a beta.  That's how it works.  They release little bits at a time. If you're not happy with how they are releasing things on their beta schedule, then I'd recommend coming back when the BETA is over.

    I never recall stating that I don't know how beta works.  Like I said, it does not really affect me;; I won't purchase. Why in the hell would I purchase or spend money on a tournament when there are deviations??? I am not gonna be in contention for a prize only to have a perfect shot land in a bunker and see my win disappear. 

    Oh, and as far as coming back...oh you bet I will.  I can't wait to come back and spend some money, on a final product that won't need upgrades.  In the meantime, I play the game for fun.  But I will stick around,,,it's still pretty fun even with these basic starter clubs I use, and this old out dated computer I own.  No, I will never win money here, but that is fine with me.  Last week I shot real life one over 73 on my home course. (not great, not bad either).  I did not get any credits or prizes, but it sure was FUN!!!! 

  • nivlac
    2,188 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 2:42 PM

    Hey look man, I'm not trying to argue with you or attack you; just offer a different point a view.

    My point was this.  Tournaments are WGT's main focus.  It's great that you enjoy the multiplayer and social aspect of the game, but that's not why they built the site.  Their tournaments bring in major sponsors and investors who are willing to pour serious $$$ into WGT then all the clubs and balls combined.  There are a ton of people who do come here for the tournaments.  WGT had to come up with a way to keep the same folks from winning every time.

    Yes, deviations can be conquered.  Even with unpredictable deviations, the best players in this game are carding 12 under par 58's (6 shots below the real course record) from the blue tees on what is supposed to be the most difficult golf course in the world.  During US Open qualifying, 61 was the low from the championship tees. 3 shots below the course record.  Deviation is the way WGT decided to try keep this game from becoming an unrealistic scoring mess like Tiger Woods.  They are supposed to be trying to secure a deal with Augusta National.  Do you think the members there want to see virtual golfers ripping their prestigious course to shreds and making it look as easy as the local track down the street?  Definitely not.

    As a golfer, you know that executing a truly perfect shot is immeasurably harder than stopping a moving meter on an impact line.  If it was, we'd all be out there knocking down 18 birds in a row without breaking a sweat.  In my opinion, that kind of pinpoint accuracy is not fun when it's relatively easy to hit the line (or swing the mouse/stick straight). 

    It's a pretty simple meter.  There's not much you can really do with it.  You can remove deviations and try to attain realistic scores by making the meter faster and making it harder to hit the line.  You can make it less forgiving on mishits, but that's about it.  The problem with those solutions is that they can easily be beaten with cheat software.  Deviations cannot be beaten with cheat software.  And I would think that if you're giving out prizes valued at $5000 your main concern would be the legitimacy of the results.

    Is it the best solution?  Maybe not.  But I think it's the best compromise for all parties.  WGT, their sponsors and the players themselves.

  • Snaike
    3,678 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 2:56 PM

    ~This was posted in reponse to this thread's twin attempting to hijack Niv's Comparsion thread in the Equipment section.~

    Hawk, Nivlac is exactly right.  Deviations are not the problem, trade ins are coming, and mulligans are for cartoon golf like TW.

    Paying $10 or so for a new driver when the game is free is more preferable than paying a monthly subscription and getting the clubs for free, isn't it?  At least this way you have a choice whether you want to upgrade or not.

    And hijacking another thread with a duplicate post should cost you more than a new set of Pings, imho.

    Have a nice day.

  • TaterNater
    545 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 3:10 PM

    Here's a thought, how many times do u actually hit a pefect golf shot on the course when u try? exactly very rarely does it do eactly what u want . as said before this is not tiger woods game play or quit. get in reality.

  • HAWK64
    14 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 4:16 PM

    Deviation is the way WGT decided to try keep this game from becoming an unrealistic scoring mess like Tiger Woods.  They are supposed to be trying to secure a deal with Augusta National.  Do you think the members there want to see virtual golfers ripping their prestigious course to shreds and making it look as easy as the local track down the street?  Definitely not.

    What????? I don't give a toot what members at Augusta think of my score in a video game.  If they care that much about a video game, then they need to grow up or get behavioral health counseling.  That is another poor excuse for making deviations.  Another poor excuse is using deviations to keep socres from getting out of hand.  Who really cares how low the socres go,  it's all relative, it's a video game. 

    But...can you or WGT really tell me in confidence that my tournament round and yours will have the same amount of deviations? No.  Is it okay if you lose, or win, because you got more or fewer deviations during your round than someone else?  NO!!! Especially if everyone paid the same amount of money to play in the tournament.  Yea, go tell Tiger Woods that the PGA is going to start giving him penalties when he makes good shots. 

    You see, using deviations to prevent cheaters sounds good, but I am also being cheated if the deviations cause me to lose a tournament, or if I encounter 3 of them on a round, and the winner gets one.  So now who got cheated?  You simply cannot punish the rest of us because of cheaters.  So they need to come up with something better.  Becasue until they do I won't spend one cent on a tournament only to be cheated by a deviation shot---one poor shot lost many a tournament, and money.

    THEY NEED SOMETHING BETTER THAN DEVIATIONS!!!! If they don't have a solution, then they should not be taking people's money!!!!!

  • TheSpaghettiKid
    424 Posts
    Sun, Aug 2 2009 4:38 PM

    with woods, irons and wedges...i don't expect a "dinged" shot to travel perfectly on its line 100% of the time... there are just to many variables.  with the putter i do expect the ball to stay on its line.  but if i read an 18 foot putt as no break, then ding it perfect, and it rolls by the left edge 8 inches... i don't consider that a bug/deviation in the game.

    i've only experienced 2 shots...with an 8i and 7i... when a dinged shot under perfect conditions (lie, wind, elevation, distance) came up way short of the green.  once on KIAWAH and once on Bethpage.... don't remember which holes off hand.

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