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High ding rate = cheating?

Sat, Dec 31 2016 5:26 PM (437 replies)
  • Jimbog1964
    8,378 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 2:17 PM

    The 40 / 79%s I am just not comfortable with at all.  Paraphrasing mark a bit, just too arbitrary looking.

    I don't sit in WGTs offices and I don't get to look Over Qs shoulder, and no point pretending different.  

    He did shoot real well at Legend, and I never saw a pattern change when he took up RGs, eventually anyway, after MPC got too hard to get a game / finish one.  Addict who was playing this game one way or the other.  In the CC he helped loads of people - always on hand whatever the level to play or advise.  I never saw any unusual sudden pattern change in any of it looking holistically.

    I am as confident as possible that Mr Otto was not out.  As said earlier to Woodo I would be much more concerned with another one, and sadly that more sinister one looks good to go??.......Don't really know for sure but take a bet some do, and not necessarily just the ones you want to.

    I only have what I have and it's shared here.  It got discussed and we felt this was an unsound decision after the trial, and the verdict summary we got.  

    I am obviously not feeling warm and fuzzy about any of this.  Sadly that includes the standard of the security sweeps, and the way applied.

     

     

     

  • ct690911
    7,205 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 3:08 PM

    Jimbog1964:
    I am obviously not feeling warm and fuzzy about any of this.  Sadly that includes the standard of the security sweeps, and the way applied.

    It seems to be applied the same way everything else is; arbitrarily. Completely at the discretion of whichever Mod is on duty that day.

    EDIT: I want to note the excellent post by fatdan. Logical, measured and fully on point.

    ct

  • oneeyedjohn
    9,577 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 3:24 PM

    Things are getting pretty repetitive around here.

    Have WGT made a final decision or not, because if they have then there is nothing more to say.

  • fatdan
    3,379 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 3:40 PM

    This will be my last go at this, a lot of valid points have been brought up, and some very good discussion both for and against...

    The key point IMO is being overlooked at this point...

    Jim can tell you that before this even started Tom posted some RG scorecards on the CC forum, in fact a lot of them....

    What caught my eye was the ADTP, it was so close on 2 of them my very 1st thought was "NO f'n way", this guy is either 1 in a million or using CE, end of thought, I don't play RG's so I will let them worry about it, if he is cheating they will get him eventually....that and I like Tom. He gets the benefit of the doubt from me because he was a unbelievably good player when he was a legend so why not now!

    So when I heard his account was closed I felt bad for him, but I wasn't surprised, that is not until other CC members started getting involved and believed he was wrongly accused, so I somewhat grudgingly looked at the correspondence fully expecting to see something like:

    Tom: For some reason my account is closed is something wrong?

    WGT: Don't even go there dude, you were cheating, you know you were, we have the data to prove you were that we got from our "super duper sweeps software", so don't even pretend to be innocent!

    And frankly, had I seen that it would have been good enough for me, end of story!!!!

    Instead what I see is communication after communication that in short say, "We don't know what you were doing because you won't admit it, but we are sure you were doing something"...WTF

    Eventually they accuse him of using an "auto dinger", again WTF!

    WGTadmin himself admitted on these very forums when the grid dots and meters went crazy after an update that they had to shut down the program that ran with the power meter to counter auto ding programs, despite what you've read in this thread you can't show me 1 ADer that dings at 80%, they get close enough to it to help a player who just plain can't play, but they DO NOT ding at 80%, so why in the world would that even be considered is beyond me!

    There is more, but lets get to the "trial", again just the fact that they did it at all says they are still assuming he cheated but really don't know how!

    After the "so called trial" and only then do they bring up this "ding %" BS....

    IMO, ding% was plan B, had he shot -4 -5 they would have just said "SEEEEEEE, we knew it", but Tom shot -8 which made them go to plan B and start all this ding% talk, and this has become the focus of the discussion when this isn't the problem here!!!

    Is 79% dings high for 30 days, your d@mn right it is...impossible for 99.99% of us but still possible!

    The REAL PROBLEM here is, he was banned because they thought he was doing something, "Guilty by ASSUMPTION"...

    I'm not sure if there are countries on WGT where this acceptable, but I do know this isn't 1 of them!
    In a freaken Capitol Murder trial if there were 5, or 1000 jurors and only 1 thought you were innocent, end of story, your free to go...

    Here, it is whether or not they think your guilty, don't need proof, we said so....that's the real problem with this, no ding tests needed although that is interesting info to know to me, here someone drops a line to CS and says I think this person is a cheat, and if they agree it is bye bye, most likely with no proof at all!!!

    The "internet cafe guy" has been the topic in many a discussion for 1yr just because he had CE on his desktop, should he have been banned, NO, not for having it on "his desktop", running in his task bar then yes, but not for having it...was he cheating, most likely with the other evidence given, it took a f'n year and it wasn't until they introduced this sweepware, as if it could really find anything...well it obviously didn't find anything on Toms PC and it only took 1 day!!!!

    In Toms case, I think it is time for WGT to admit that Customer Service "Marcia Clarked" this one, they admitted over and over they didn't know what he did, but his stats were highly suspect, so it is time to do the right thing, reinstate him with a notice that he will be watched very closely!

    You can bet everyone here will be watching, and very closely!!!!

     

  • Tigerpaw509
    1,285 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 5:12 PM

    This fellow also said he wasnt a crook

  • mkg335
    5,491 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 5:23 PM

    Tigerpaw, nice try and thanks for playing.

  • fatdan
    3,379 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 5:44 PM

    Tigerpaw509:

    This fellow also said he wasnt a crook

    As do 99% of all prisoners, until they realize they have to accept responsibility at their parole hearing to get paroled, then they are ALL guilty!

    However, I know a guy personally who could have been paroled after 4 yrs of a 14yr sentence if he did this, and refused to because he didn't do it...

    He did 11 yrs, and 2 yrs after he got out they found out he was in fact innocent!

    He was a cop by the way! Checkmate!

     

  • ct690911
    7,205 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 6:05 PM

    fatdan:

    Tigerpaw509:

    This fellow also said he wasn't a crook

    As do 99% of all prisoners, until they realize they have to accept responsibility at their parole hearing to get paroled, then they are ALL guilty!

    However, I know a guy personally who could have been paroled after 4 yrs of a 14yr sentence if he did this, and refused to because he didn't do it...

    He did 11 yrs, and 2 yrs after he got out they found out he was in fact innocent!

    He was a cop by the way! Checkmate!

    "This will be my last go at this"

    Dan, apparently you and I share same DNA...lol

  • coors71
    656 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 6:24 PM

    fatdan:
    Checkmate!

    +1 

     

     

    "A narrow mind and a wide mouth usually go together"

     

  • WillyBigg
    2,135 Posts
    Thu, Jul 21 2016 7:01 PM

    Wgt, come on & grow a pair. Just admit you made a mistake, apologize to this fine, honest gentleman you have banned & let's get back to playing the game. It's ridiculous to continue avoiding the truth any longer, you know you are in the wrong. You gave this player a chance to prove his skill honestly & he did without a doubt. Then you come up with this ignorant excuse to continue to ban him. WHY?

    Wgt, you are truly not looking good. Not sure if I ever want to play your game again after seeing your seriously biased persecution of an innocent man.

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