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High ding rate = cheating?

Sat, Dec 31 2016 5:26 PM (437 replies)
  • ct690911
    7,205 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 2:21 PM

    33 pages and counting...lot's of points and counterpoints. What about the point that most who get banned, simply return using an alias?

    Anybody computer literate enough to work the system, and greedy enough to cheat people out of credits, probably won't take much of a break before he/she is back.

    Even if he/she is innocent, I expect a return.

    Probably reading this thread now...and laughing.

    ct

  • fatdan
    3,379 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 3:36 PM

    lonniescott711:

    No I didnt miss anything . Its WGTs game and they decide who gets to play it  You missed the point of the fact that you dont really know Q so you cant say what he will or wont do . You cant say as to the real truth of his guilt and thats the point . WGT gave them an answer as to why they were banned period .

    You still don't get it, not about whether he did or didn't, or how well I know him, it's about them not knowing whether he did or didn't and they don't know for sure, but banned him anyway! GEEEEZUS

    I will absolutely guarantee you they don't have any proof other than ding % too, they can't, and if there was a sweep software that could do what everyone thinks it can they would have banned 500, not 5...if it pulled up multiple IP's make that 5000....

    Go play a practice round under the same conditions and see if you can hit the ding as much as they gave Q credit for . If you ever take time and really study this game and not just play it you will be surprised at what you have been missing .

    If you read the thread like you say you did, you would have seen that I already did, I'll let you look for it!

    As for WGT kicking out of the game for cheating that wont happen . One because Im a miss the ding player and 2 I dont play for credits or the monthly events either . Other than practice rounds I dont even play outsied of my cc but if I do its stroke play and thats all ..

    I agree, wellllll, unless someone decides they don't want you here anymore, like you said, "they decide who plays and who doesn't", and they can obviously ban whomever for whatever if they so choose to!

     

  • lonniescott711
    4,207 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 4:55 PM

    fatdan:

    lonniescott711:

    No I didnt miss anything . Its WGTs game and they decide who gets to play it  You missed the point of the fact that you dont really know Q so you cant say what he will or wont do . You cant say as to the real truth of his guilt and thats the point . WGT gave them an answer as to why they were banned period .

    You still don't get it, not about whether he did or didn't, or how well I know him, it's about them not knowing whether he did or didn't and they don't know for sure, but banned him anyway! GEEEEZUS

    I will absolutely guarantee you they don't have any proof other than ding % too, they can't, and if there was a sweep software that could do what everyone thinks it can they would have banned 500, not 5...if it pulled up multiple IP's make that 5000....

    Go play a practice round under the same conditions and see if you can hit the ding as much as they gave Q credit for . If you ever take time and really study this game and not just play it you will be surprised at what you have been missing .

    If you read the thread like you say you did, you would have seen that I already did, I'll let you look for it!

    As for WGT kicking out of the game for cheating that wont happen . One because Im a miss the ding player and 2 I dont play for credits or the monthly events either . Other than practice rounds I dont even play outsied of my cc but if I do its stroke play and thats all ..

    I agree, wellllll, unless someone decides they don't want you here anymore, like you said, "they decide who plays and who doesn't", and they can obviously ban whomever for whatever if they so choose to!

    No dan you are the one who doesnt get it . How do you know what WGT either has or doesnt have ? Do you work for WGT or Top Golf dan ? Can you speak with absolute authority for the company dan ?  Unless the answer is yes then you are just blowing smoke and thats all .

    Gee dan you act more like this is going to be the end of the world and its not that serious . You want to raise a million dollars worth of hell over someone who was banned for cheating . You say that you dont care but I cant tell . You say its not about whether Q was guilty of cheating or not but as to does WGT have the right to ban players from using their product . Read the T/Cs dan once again its their game and yes its their right to decide just that for whatever reason they choose . They dont have to explain it not at all .

    If they decide they no longer want me to play no big deal . I play for free dan and always have . 5 years now and never spent a penny out of pocket for ball or club upgrades .Currently have over 21k in free credits with nothing to buy . The only thing that I have invested in this game is my free time .

    So drink a beer dan smoke a joint kiss your girl and tell her you love her . But as for this dan you really do need to LET IT GO !!!!!!!!!!!!  :-) HAVE A NICE DAY

     

     

  • WillyBigg
    2,135 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 5:06 PM

    Not that serious, eh Lonnie? How would you feel if you had worked your tail off playing this game for 10 hours a day, everyday. And had built up a nice cache of credits HONESTLY & tomorrow you wake up not being able to log into your account. Then to find out you had been banned, permanently. IMO you do not get it at all & should stfu. If it's not so serious why are you here running your mouth. 

    We will raise all the hell we like if you don't like it, tough!

  • lonniescott711
    4,207 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 6:01 PM

    WillyBigg:

    Not that serious, eh Lonnie? How would you feel if you had worked your tail off playing this game for 10 hours a day, everyday. And had built up a nice cache of credits HONESTLY & tomorrow you wake up not being able to log into your account. Then to find out you had been banned, permanently. IMO you do not get it at all & should stfu. If it's not so serious why are you here running your mouth. 

    We will raise all the hell we like if you don't like it, tough!

    Been here for 5 years 21k in credits in my account L101 Champion . How much harder do I have to work Willy ? I have played so much that my click finger was sore . I used to take a couple of aleve before I started playing . At one time I had gotten up to 1333 cdp so how much harder do I have to work Willy ? I mean if you want to kiss up some guys behind over a game you go ahead knock your self out . But you can tell your mammy to stfu .

    Maybe you talk to your wife or kids that way but Im not them . I havent disrespected anyone here in this thread but I am about to get in your ass . You all on your knees in a zipper lock over some guy who can no lnoger play the game and want to throw a temper tantrum like a pitiful little 2 year old . I get everything that ws said its the rest of you who dont seem to have a clue .

     WGT does not have to explain themselves or their decisions to any of us you are included in the us . If you dont like that then dont play the game and thats the way it is .WGT does not care if you stay or if you leave and that goes for all to whom it may apply .

     So get your head out of your behind because none of you are going to change a thing . Go find your girl friend Q and have a nice day , Because no one cares  not really . But for you to tell me as to what I get just goes to show how much you dont get .This may be the best golf sim on line but not the only game . I have others that I play when Im not on this ,

    Makes me wonder though why so many are so upset maybe all the cheaters havent been caught yet . Maybe some of you are just as dirty as Q and are waiting for the shoe to drop on you as well . Maybe hoping that Q wont spill their guts and tell on the rest of you as well . As the saying goes " You throw a rock at a pack of dogs and you will hit one every time " Now if you will excuse me I have a couple of beers in my freezer that need my attention .

    I will be back later for the next round of banter from the cry baby crew .

     

  • iukine
    195 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 6:07 PM

    I actually brought this up about 5 yrs ago, when a friend of mine, who does not play this game, explained to me about hacking a system and running a program that will make it easier to ding. He said that it would be pretty much undetectable. He was wrong on that! This guy is a programmer for a large computer co. Needless to say I was raked over the coals by a lot of people on here that said it was impossible to do any kind of cheating on here. I hope that's true! But it seems that there is some possibility of that happening. I do not confess to being any kind of comp programmer, I'm middle of the road at best, but not all the players on here are as bad at it as I am. Which means that if there is a player that can supe up his comp enough to fool the system well then it'll be done. Not familiar with the player in question, but I've seen some scores on here that make your hair stand on end.

  • Jimbog1964
    8,378 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 6:15 PM

    DodgyPutter:
    I've no idea why you quoted me then didn't address my point.

    Thought it was easy enough.  Two weeks off and a gawd awful meter on a "test / trial / whatever" is not much use I thought all agreed.  It's also very accepted what  "WGT said".  The thread addresses room for error, the farce of the "trial" and how they might do things different.  Easy stuff that part I thought.

    DodgyPutter:
    Quotation marks are my friend :-)

     

    I agree quotation marks are your friend:)

     

    DodgyPutter:
    My point about the round is; you will also have noted in the "prev 1020 pages" that there is some confusion as to what shots WGT use to arrive at their 40%/80%, surely this round can provide the answer:  WGT say his ding percentage was 40% during it, simply count how many drives, approaches and putts he did and didn't ding.

    See above.......But fair to say It (that part) has been a large part of the point for the now v extensive thread.

    Personally I don't for one minute think they had 30 days of data.  Snap shots maybe, but 30 days solid 10 hours a day nah.  Not sitting over their shoulders any more than his, but auto dinger (see thread) it was not.  BS completely that part of the  "verdict".  

    EDIT: May I suggest we just let what is becomming largely a small side discussion go.  It's all been said and you and I talking at cross purposes (no blame either side if we can agree) is not going to be useful.

  • mkg335
    5,491 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 6:25 PM

    Lonnie, if wgt banned a friend/clubmate of yours for cheating, and you had good reasons to think they had made a mistake, wouldn't you consider it unfair and rise to his defense?  I believe we value the same things, and one of those things is that a man's reputation counts for something and is worth defending.

    Not to rehash the same argument, but others have raised objections similar to yours, the idea that "wgt must have something on him they're not revealing."  That's already been addressed...they have no way of detecting what's on a player's computer unless they're watching a twitched round and the player has task manager open.  Remember what they said to Q:  "Just tell us what you're using."  All they had to go on was his ding rate over a 30 day period, and then the results of a "trial", the details of which have already been discussed.

    That's it...they have nothing more.  If you think they do have more, please tell us what it might be.  They can't see what, if any, programs you're running while playing.

    So we have the following:  Assumed guilty, not told the nature of his offense prior to the trial nor what evidence he must present to prove his innocence, only after the trial, the conditions of which made it very difficult to ding because of a jumpy meter, is he told it was all about ding rate.  To top it off, he still managed to shoot -8 for 9 holes under difficult conditions.  The kangaroo court then determined him guilty and banned him permanently.

    As I said in an earlier post, it's all very Kafkaesque and contrary to every rule of fairness I've learned from childhood on.

    If what I've laid out above is at all credible, I'd like to think you'd be just as strident and persistent in defending a friend.

  • lonniescott711
    4,207 Posts
    Thu, Aug 4 2016 7:10 PM

    mkg335:

    Lonnie, if wgt banned a friend/clubmate of yours for cheating, and you had good reasons to think they had made a mistake, wouldn't you consider it unfair and rise to his defense?  I believe we value the same things, and one of those things is that a man's reputation counts for something and is worth defending.

    Not to rehash the same argument, but others have raised objections similar to yours, the idea that "wgt must have something on him they're not revealing."  That's already been addressed...they have no way of detecting what's on a player's computer unless they're watching a twitched round and the player has task manager open.  Remember what they said to Q:  "Just tell us what you're using."  All they had to go on was his ding rate over a 30 day period, and then the results of a "trial", the details of which have already been discussed.

    That's it...they have nothing more.  If you think they do have more, please tell us what it might be.  They can't see what, if any, programs you're running while playing.

    So we have the following:  Assumed guilty, not told the nature of his offense prior to the trial nor what evidence he must present to prove his innocence, only after the trial, the conditions of which made it very difficult to ding because of a jumpy meter, is he told it was all about ding rate.  To top it off, he still managed to shoot -8 for 9 holes under difficult conditions.  The kangaroo court then determined him guilty and banned him permanently.

    As I said in an earlier post, it's all very Kafkaesque and contrary to every rule of fairness I've learned from childhood on.

    If what I've laid out above is at all credible, I'd like to think you'd be just as strident and persistent in defending a friend.

    OK once again it doesnt matter what any of you think or how you feel about the matter . I understand what every one is saying in Qs defense you all feel that he got a raw deal and how it all went down . The excuse that WGT gave for their decision as well as how they went about gathering the information just doesnt pan out . I get that too . I aslo get they are your friend and a club member see I get it .

    Now heres is what you guys dont seem to get . WGT doesnt care if you like it or not . Just like your friend you can leave too . The reason they gave may not seem or sound good to you but again they dont care . In the T/Cs they state they can do with this game whatever they want to and that any and all parts of this game belongs entirely to them . You as well as all of us agree to those terms every time that we longin and play this game .

    So just because we dont like their excuse wont change a thing . They are not going to openly tell what or how they can detect when a player is using cheat software to play the game . They wont even tell us what they are going to do when they do maintenance or what new items they are going to add to the pro shop .

    They wont tell us what it takes to tier up and since this thread is about another players account they wont respond to this thread in detail any more than they already have . I dont know what they have to tell if players are cheating but then neither do any of you . But I do know they can turn up or down the meter and also target a players individual account .A former mod stated that a few years ago .

    So maybe thats what they did made it as to where he shouldnt have been able to shoot -8 out of 9 holes under those conditions and hit the ding at 40% . Did you think about that ? Its neither here no there now though as they are gone gone gone . What I think or feel is not important nor will it change a thing as far as WGT is concerned .Whether I agree with you or not will also not change a thing .

    So take it easy M you have done all that you can do besides Q is more than likely playing under a new account and even back in the club . They are just going to have to keep a low profile for awhile thats all . No RGs for them any time soon WGT wont be giving them back their old account and those credits are long gone . So tell Q when you play him I said hey and sorry about how it went down .But it happens to the best of us at some point and time .

     

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