Forums

Re: Putting Math (not for the faint of heart)

• JFidanza 1,676 Posts

  Tue, Jul 22 2014 3:28 PM

  pdb1:

    Most of us probably will never be able to play merion and the like Esecially the greens on any sort of consistant basis . 

  I concur, and I've read the opinion of members who think Merion is one of the Most Detested Courses . So, I decided to play it many more times recently. 

  I did not shoot a good game. I don't think I made par. But I did notice that many of the camera angles are sometimes skewed a little more vs other courses. I think that in the past I may have misconstrued the wind direction which equals a bad drive, bad approach, so I had to be aware of the incongruence of the wind direction pointer to the camera angle & mini-map's usual orientation  on the screen. 

  I will keep practicing. 

   

   Happy Hitting.

   

  edit: An added observation that has worked for me:

  When hitting any general strait putt, on basically a level green, at a close range (under 15 feet approx.) I have found that the putt will more often drop if I pull it a hair (before ding) then if I ding or miss to the right. (slight push) Sounds weird, but if it wasn't working out for me I wouldn't continue to use the technique.

  Results will vary.

• Jimbog1964 8,378 Posts

  Tue, Jul 22 2014 4:41 PM

  For my part reading this thread there is more than one road to Rome.  There are several calcs, and some I disagree with a bit more but I am old so get stuck in my ways.  The key is though that any calc is a base calc that the individual is comfortable with, and can adapt around.

  Merion is it's own special place so to shoot sub even 30 there on just the B9 you have to know the course.  Some days the approaches all seem in place better than others and the bird putts are real chances, some days a bit of luck happens and an across face one drops, and some days may have well stayed at home:)

  Mapping of irons with one preferred ball, as start point is essential.  After that knowing how some holes play may also be necessary. As Ken alluded to it's about boxing clever sometimes on the green.  No one normal expects to sink a 20 foot across face putt usually, but we can expect to leave it real close to walk away with no worse than par.  Also and no disrespect here Ken as I appreciate you said you need to fudge (adapt) sometimes, and also sensibly looking to just be close I do agree with Mainz that those longer putts on V Fast look shy of the mark for any calc I have.  Wind can make a difference, as can terrain (6 inches linear drop over 30 feet versus 27 feet then cliff edge etc etc.  Go on for ages but in the end on V fast any calc should be getting you close with some common sense also.

  Not being condescending JF, Ken and Pd or anyone hit me up anytime.  If I can go round Merion "OK" any one can.  It's about being able to adapt around basic calcs in my book, and all you guys have exactly the right attitude for that to happen easier than you may think.

  People that can't / won't accept that, and think they can do it all with one definitive calc off the bat  will still be having the same issues looking for the candy crush golden fleece this time next year and ......  There are many better putters than me (ignore some other fake 71% 1 putter's stats from Beth F9 only), but pretty sure I can help out any one genuine who has an issue with putting at Merion.  Fine tune as much as you want after with loads of methods, but good enough for reasonable play.

• JFidanza 1,676 Posts

  Sat, Jul 26 2014 12:46 AM

   

  Jimbog1964:

   

  Not being condescending JF, Ken and Pd or anyone hit me up anytime.  If I can go round Merion "OK" any one can.  It's about being able to adapt around basic calcs in my book, and all you guys have exactly the right attitude for that to happen easier than you may think.

   

  update: jimbog was nice enough to set up a game with me, and he liked my distance control, I did use a few of the calculations here. I bashed a few too hard on the last green to crash and burn, as usual. ;)

  He was hitting nice long putt, and ones from the edge on Mer B9. I am looking forward to more social games, and learning some more things from y'all.

   

• BubbaCrusher007 1,567 Posts

  Sat, Jul 26 2014 8:06 PM

  JFidanza:

  I have found that the putt will more often drop if I pull it a hair (before ding)

   

  I noticed the same thing on Marion greens and with the pitch shots as well, a slight early ding holes it.

• WGTicon 12,511 Posts

  Sun, Jul 27 2014 4:08 AM

  wow, about time someone broke it down like that

  respect :)

  for me, I see distance, approximate and hit. but this is pretty impressive!

  -wgticon

• PBaldwin 108 Posts

  Wed, Jul 30 2014 7:59 AM

  I've also come up with a putting formula working with a friend on it.  We worked hard on it trying to get 40-50 footers within 2 feet to avoid 3 putting.  It worked most of the time but there are a few greens in which it can be a little bit off, which I keep a mental note of.  They are mostly at Oakmont and Merion on champ greens which continue to drop off in elevation past the pin.  Getting the break right is also very important with the calculation, as missing low of the pin can send a downhill side putt even further past.  I also use the same calculations for every course and every green speed and never adjust.  I've been meaning to work on it for each course, but just haven't really felt like working on it any more.

  Your numbers on very fast greens are pretty similar, some within a few inches and others are about 2 ft different than mine in the examples you posted.  I'd say your formula is pretty good.

  We have also worked on wind and elevation calculations.  That's a little bit trickier to get right as we have found that 100% FBS shots react quite differently than even a 99% FBS shot in the wind.  It seems to still require some on the fly adjustments.  I'm not sure it's possible to go 100% by a calculator in this game.

• SplashLewis 363 Posts

  Mon, Aug 4 2014 7:21 AM

  For Tournament speed or thereabouts, use the standard calculations for level and uphill putts.  For DOWNHILL, take off AN ADDITIONAL 2% power for every inch of elevation downhill. 

  Example if you're standard calculation says hit with 60% power for a putt that is 3 inches downhill, then putt it at 54% ( I actually add another 1% at the end, to get 53%).   It doesn't matter the distance, as that is already factored in standard calculation.

  For you Excel users...

  cell H12 = The Standard calculation(%)

  Cell F8 = elevation

  the new putting power is =H12+IF(F8<0,2*F8/100*1.2,0)

   

• SplashLewis 363 Posts

  Tue, Aug 5 2014 4:58 AM

   

  The generally accepted +/- 1ft per 1 inch of elevation is what I call standard.