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Re: why is there no penalty for not finishing ?

• Faterson 2,902 Posts

  Thu, Jul 23 2009 7:21 PM

  Here's a suggestion for a possible punishment for quitters: if you quit a game prematurely (and the server might be capable of distinguishing voluntary disconnections from time-outs due to failed Internet connection), the punishment would be that your next ranked round would not count towards your average score. That means that the quitter would have to play the next 9 full holes basically in practice mode. Yeah, they can shoot a +30 carelessly in that round and get it over with, but it would take some 10 minutes away from their lives, and might serve as a mild deterrent to keep them from quitting games. Also, this type of punishment would be of no help to sandbaggers whatsoever; on the contrary: they'd have to go through one more full (half-)round that would have no effect on their average score.

• GSpinks1962 106 Posts

  Thu, Jul 23 2009 7:47 PM

   

  I have read these posts many times and have yet to understand the why this bothers folks so. In what circumstance to you elude to a quitter gaining any advantage in this game from quitting? Neither are awarded anything that I have been able to find for a match. Someone that quits to avoid shooting a bad score is only doing harm to themselves. They will only manage to send themselves into the next tier where they will not be competitive. I’m not defending the practice by any means just trying to understand the issue. There is no award that I know of for having a low scoring average or am I missing some other stat? I play with a close bunch of friends that hangs out on teamspeak where none of us ever quit but cannot find a win/loss record for matches or a rating in match play so this doesn’t make a bit of sense to me. The only time I can think you could can any type of advantage quitting is if you’re playing too good a round and didn’t want to lower your scoring average.

   

• Faterson 2,902 Posts

  Thu, Jul 23 2009 8:11 PM

  GSpinks1962:

  There is no award that I know of for having a low scoring average or am I missing some other stat?

  I believe it's simply the feeling of I want to keep on lowering my average score that is enough to motivate many players to quit their bad rounds. I'm no psychologist, but there's probably an innate desire in all human beings to keep improving in what they enjoy doing. And that's perfectly fine, except that accomplishing it by quitting bad rounds is really deceiving oneself instead of really improving; but perhaps many quitters don't clearly realize that, and all that they're interested in is to see that low 70s or even 60s score shining next to their name. They may not even think of tiers in that context; the low number itself is sufficient motivation. A thing of prestige, snobbery, and personal vanity.

  Also, folks can be pretty ruthless. I had an average score of about 72 a couple of weeks ago, and it was a lot easier for me to find partners for multi-player games than today when I'm hovering around the 77 average. You'd be surprised how many folks with low 70s average scores immediately kick you out of a multi-player game before it even launches just because your average score isn't as low as theirs. So, having a low average score definitely brings a perceived advantage or two to a golfer.

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Fri, Jul 24 2009 4:32 PM

  Pardon me, Faterson.. but have you considered the possibility that it's not your score that keeps you from some MP games?

  I have never kicked someone from a game I wanted to start, but there are certain people with whom I will not suffer through a round of golf.  There are a number of people on these forums who are adamant about calling out those who quit rounds, and they are at the top of my list to avoid.

  Contrary to popular belief, people quit for a number of reasons other than they have hit a bad shot or are afraid of damaging their average.  I have had to bail from a number of games that would have LOWERED my ranking and average due to real life issues.  (Computer, kids, job, etc etc etc).

  People quit, get used to it.  It has no effect on your rankings, scoring, or round.

• Faterson 2,902 Posts

  Sat, Jul 25 2009 2:10 AM

  Snaike:

  Contrary to popular belief, people quit for a number of reasons other than they have hit a bad shot or are afraid of damaging their average.

  That's a lame and endlessly rehashed attempt at justifying quitters. From now on, whenever someone repeats that line of justification, I'm just gonna cut & paste what I already said about this in another post last week:

  Faterson:

  There are definitely instances where real life or PC issues interfere, causing someone to abandon a multi-player game, but believe me it's highly unlikely that those issues would occur exactly at the moment when one has posted a quadruple bogey or hit the drive in the forest on hole 1. One can usually distinguish voluntary from involuntary quitting pretty clearly. Unless there are PC issues, at least typing Bye in the Chat window, or Sorry need to go, would be the minimum that one would expect from one's partners in a round. [Also, you can, and perhaps should, later post a brief apology to your fellow players' profile pages if you get booted from a round with them involuntarily and/or were unable to access the Chat window to say good-bye.]

  Snaike:

  have you considered the possibility that it's not your score that keeps you from some MP games?

  Considered & rejected. The booting happens within the blink of an eye, so it's clear the game host just sits there & automatically rejects anyone with, say, higher than a 75 average. He's simply looking at the average score numbers as they pop up on the screen. It's not about personalities of players, because once you get a low enough average score, you don't get booted instantly.

• lilrob88 870 Posts

  Sat, Jul 25 2009 11:01 AM

  Why do you insist on punishing quitters? It will accomplish nothing. Too many forum post on quitters. Snaike I agree with you and a previous statement made by claremoreblue. 100%. If you are playing multi and someone bails then you simply deal with it and continue, if it makes you feel better sigh for a second and then continue foward. No imparticular rule that says someone has to finish a round. No matter how many people complain it will not solve anything.

• Faterson 2,902 Posts

  Sat, Jul 25 2009 11:26 AM

  lilrob88:

  No matter how many people complain it will not solve anything.

  Just your opinion! Of course if there was a punishment for quitting too early, all those folks who currently quit to preserve their artificially deflated average scores would no longer quit. So, there is a solution. There are, however, worries about sandbagging & about distinguishing voluntary from involuntary disconnections. That's why I proposed a very mild "deterrent solution" at the top of this webpage.

  PS: I find it amusing it's usually Masters who complain about ordinary folks complaining about quitting...   That's ironic, as Masters probably encounter quitters less frequently than the rest of us, due to Masters often playing multi-players with golfers of their own class and/or ones they are familiar with.

• lilrob88 870 Posts

  Sat, Jul 25 2009 11:39 AM

  No i play with plenty of people who quit, most of which do so after hitting a bad shot, or making a huge number on a hole. What exactly do you mean by "ordinary folks"? Anyone on this game no matter what their tier is, is just as normal as me or you.

  Secondly regardless of a penalty people will still quit. They will simply play a few single rounds to get their stroke avg back. You can only penalize so much, and even if there was a penalty I'm sure it would be nothing more than a tenth of a stroke. The cost of quitting will and would weigh less than finishing.

• tibbets 1,043 Posts

  Sat, Jul 25 2009 11:47 AM

  What isn't amusing is that people still bother with this issue.   Here's an excerpt from a post of mine about 9 months ago:

   "Seems to me that if you're that concerned with someone elses average going up or down, you've got your mind on the wrong thing, which is your own score.  What someone else shoots is irrelevant to your own game.

  If you play someone in Multiplayer and they leave, guess what?  Who cares! You were going to keep playing until the end anyway, from the sound of it.  Once again, your competition is irrelevant.  You don't win any special prize for 'winning' a match in Multiplayer, therefore it would follow that there would be no special penalty for 'losing' either, regarless of whether it is a loss over 9 holes or 1, or the manner in which the loss took place."

  What I said then is just as true now.  What I do find amusing is that the people who complain most about other people quitting are, forgive the honesty, achingly average players who, rather than focusing on improving their own game, waste their time bothering with an issue as insignificant to the grand scheme of the game as this one.  Golf is a game of man/woman vs. course, not vs. each other.  The more one focuses on what their competition is doing, the less focus they are putting on their own game, thereby affecting overall performance.  Perhaps this would help explain why those of us at the top who don't worry about such things are at the top in the first place!  We focus on our own game.  I suggest each one of you who are focusing on other peoples actions in gameplay to do the same.

• lilrob88 870 Posts

  Sat, Jul 25 2009 1:56 PM

  Tibbs I agree with you 100%!!! As i have allready said this topic is very old and people just need to leave it be. Deal with it. Not the end of the world.