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Re: Wind Direction at St Andrews Front 9 or any course ???

• DarSum 1,440 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 5:52 AM

  WGTicon:

  that's the right answer. i realize it's not the same in real life but then again, we seen players play in morning in calm winds and then afternoon group get dry greens and 20-30mph winds...that's likely worse than totally random winds.

  -wgticon

  Completely disagree. That's golf. You know halfway what to expect when you're on the first tee. The wind should play true to the course. Here's an example of the wind I got yesterday in the STA 500 credit RG.

  #1 21 mph head 

  #2 19 head

  #3 18 head

  #4 20 head (at this point I went to STA website to see which way these holes ran)

  #5 18 head

  #6 15 head

  #7 20 left to right

  And the reason for my op were the last two holes. The wind reversed directions lol 8 and 9 run the same direction.

  #8 20 head

  # 9 19 tail (gee thanks)

  Not only a crappy draw on the wind but this is a "moderate" wind tourney. Moderate but riiiiiiight on the verge of heavy. lol

  (tin foil hat on) Now I'm starting to see what people mean about having a good round then it all the sudden goes to crap. Like when you're 3 or 4 under and it takes an extra 30 seconds or so for the continue button to highlight. You can pretty much guess what wind direction you're going to get at #5.

  Oh well. Everybody has to deal with it. 

• ForrestLeigh 264 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 6:19 AM

  DarSum:

  Oh well. Everybody has to deal with it. 

  Why?, when it can be changed to be fair to all?

  In a 100cr tourney you can shrug and say that, but in a 500/1K/2K tourney?

  What about the Majors? single play, heavy random winds - is that fair?

• DarSum 1,440 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 6:49 AM

  ForrestLeigh:

  DarSum:

  Oh well. Everybody has to deal with it. 

  Why?, when it can be changed to be fair to all?

  In a 100cr tourney you can shrug and say that, but in a 500/1K/2K tourney?

  What about the Majors? single play, heavy random winds - is that fair?

  What I can't believe is here all this time I thought the winds blew in a constant direction with the course. Say STA Back 9. One guy might have a tail wind on 10 the other a head wind but opposite once they got to 17 or 18. I guess it shows how much I pay attention. That is what I thought the random winds were. And honestly I can live with that.

  The way it's set up now with random winds out of any direction on every hole is.....well BS.

  HTF did I not notice this sooner..... brain dead.

  And no I never said it was fair.

• b0geybuster 2,574 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 6:51 AM

  ForrestLeigh:

  DarSum:

  Oh well. Everybody has to deal with it. 

  Why?, when it can be changed to be fair to all?

  In a 100cr tourney you can shrug and say that, but in a 500/1K/2K tourney?

  What about the Majors? single play, heavy random winds - is that fair?

  I can tell you this, over time its fair.  You play the RG once, likely not fair, you play it everytime its available, its fair.  Its random, and the law of averages would have everyone seeing all kinds of winds.   

  For the majors I have suggested before that they should be 4 rounds, this would ensure that all players would see all winds.

  Now lets look at the scenerio for same winds for all.  I for one do not want this.

  Hypothetically, I play, I dont do so well, i pass wind information to lets say argument sake when he grinded RGs Iconian.   He know knows he doesnt need a 3wd, cause all par 5s are downwind.  You dont know that, cause I am not gonna let you know. 

  He know carries 4 wedges instead of 3.  I also let him know what I shot on every hole and the result.  A player like Iconian when he played would shave 2-5 strokes easy of his game with this information.   Is that hard to understand?  Do you really want that?

  Cheers,

  b0gey

• oksymoron 110 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 7:16 AM

  piztaker:

  ForrestLeigh:

  piztaker:

  It's the fairest way. Honest.

  what would be unfair about everyone getting the same wind direction?

   

  Nothing at all sir, but that is not what was asked.

   

   

  Well, by claiming that random winds are the fairest way you imply that there's something not fair or less fair in the same-winds-for-all. So if u deny that implication in the next post you undermine your own answer to "what was asked". 

  In fact, from the players' perspective, it seems so evident that the-same-winds-for-all is the fairest solution (or at least much fairer than the random winds), that it's really surprising that Icon, who's a player himself, disagrees (or so i understand his reply). Maybe he's just so good that he birdies par5's regardless of the wind. But for the mere mortals, 30 mph tailwind/headwind on StA #14 usually means a difference between eagle/birdie and par/bogey (or OB if u desperately go for the birdie)  and so on and so on (the negative difference on one hole is not necessarily compensated by a positive difference on others). The arguments have been repeated in many threads. The counterargument to the effect that multiaccounters would benefit from the-same-winds is wooly. They can benefit more in the present circumstances - the more accounts they use to play the tournament the higher probablity that they'll get the perfect wind conditions in one of the rounds.

   

   

• oksymoron 110 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 7:37 AM

  b0geybuster:

  Hypothetically, I play, I dont do so well, i pass wind information to lets say argument sake when he grinded RGs Iconian.   He know knows he doesnt need a 3wd, cause all par 5s are downwind.  You dont know that, cause I am not gonna let you know. 

  He know carries 4 wedges instead of 3.  I also let him know what I shot on every hole and the result.  A player like Iconian when he played would shave 2-5 strokes easy of his game with this information.   Is that hard to understand?  Do you really want that?

  It's not hard to understand and yes I do want that. I doubt Iconian needs 4 wedges, for 2 are enough. 2-5 strokes is a number out of nowhere. And the whole thought experiment is quite pointless bc some players play their rounds constantly asking top players what to hit, and they "shave 2-5 strokes" thanks to this strategy. So the-same-winds won't change anything in this respect. On the other hand, multiacounters are better off in the random winds.

• ForrestLeigh 264 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 8:38 AM

  b0geybuster:

  ForrestLeigh:

  DarSum:

  Oh well. Everybody has to deal with it. 

  Why?, when it can be changed to be fair to all?

  In a 100cr tourney you can shrug and say that, but in a 500/1K/2K tourney?

  What about the Majors? single play, heavy random winds - is that fair?

  I can tell you this, over time its fair.  You play the RG once, likely not fair, you play it everytime its available, its fair.  Its random, and the law of averages would have everyone seeing all kinds of winds.   

  For the majors I have suggested before that they should be 4 rounds, this would ensure that all players would see all winds.

  Now lets look at the scenerio for same winds for all.  I for one do not want this.

  Hypothetically, I play, I dont do so well, i pass wind information to lets say argument sake when he grinded RGs Iconian.   He know knows he doesnt need a 3wd, cause all par 5s are downwind.  You dont know that, cause I am not gonna let you know. 

  He know carries 4 wedges instead of 3.  I also let him know what I shot on every hole and the result.  A player like Iconian when he played would shave 2-5 strokes easy of his game with this information.   Is that hard to understand?  Do you really want that?

  Cheers,

  b0gey

  I do see your point, and I wouldn't disagree, but I would rather you do tell someone the wind direction (if you so wished) in a single play RG - whoever you told still has to play the shot/hole the putt, but at least we would all get the chance to do that - at the moment that is my beef - some players get the chance to eagle/birdie others in the same comp get par/bogey

  Also, it only really evens out if you play the same competition, its not even if I get poor winds in a 2K tournament, then I get great winds in a 100cr tournament

   

• SweetiePie91 269 Posts

  Tue, Dec 20 2011 9:52 AM

  b0geybuster:

  I can tell you this, over time its fair.  You play the RG once, likely not fair, you play it everytime its available, its fair.  Its random, and the law of averages would have everyone seeing all kinds of winds.   

  Over time its fair yes maybe. But your laws of average isnt that correct. 

  Every time you enter a tournament you will get random winds. This means that you can get head winds on every hole EVERY time you play a tourny. Statistically this will happen for a member or 2 and i dont think they like the system..

  Why not just make it fair for everyone from the beginning? Make same winds for everyone and its totally fair! That cant be argued against.. 

  Why try to argue that it is ok what we have now maybe over time, MAYBE, when WGT can make it fair for everyone in a short period of time? Its not hard to make so everyone get the same winds in a tournament is it?? Then they have the worst programmers ever lol