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Legends greens..

• aceydeucey 504 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 9:22 PM

  Why can't WGT just have four green speeds: stimp 10, 11, 12, 13.  

  Then assign the course a daily or weekly stimpmeter speed and post it somewhere so a player will know prior to playing the course or accepting an invite.  

  This would also cut down on the Removals from multi games by lower tiers.  Hard to get a tour pro to  play with a legend.  

  Then if WGT would implement awarding experience points at the start of a game, it would not matter at all who quits.

  See how it all ties in together and everyone will be happy and no one will complain...lol!

• andyson 6,415 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 9:28 PM

  YankeeJim:

  Not asking you to buy it, that's what he said.

  He never once mentioned AS talking about green speeds.  You're reading way too much into it.

  Think about this

  (Legend) Tournament is Stimp 12.0 and

  (TM) Tournament is is Stimp 11.0 and they are both exactly 1.0 apart and called Tournament

  but (Master & Tour Pro) Very Fast is Stimp 10.0 and

  (Pro) Fast is Stimp 9.0 also exactly 1.0 apart, so why isn't it also called Very Fast?

  Its within the same range of 1.0 as the two Tournaments.

  Also, when there is no Legend or TM in an AS and there are Masters and Tour Pros what the heck do they call the green speed?  I'd bet its Very Fast.  And not one complaint ever, in my memory, that its not truly Very Fast in AS between Masters and Pros.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 9:31 PM

  andyson:

  He never once mentioned AS talking about green speeds.  You're reading way too much into it.

  OK, replace AS with mixed tiers such as you get in an All Players tournament. Same difference. You still haven't addressed the in between values. The only time they're whole numbers is in tiered tournaments.

  The more this gets discussed, the more not having different names makes sense and I can see why they don't bother with it.

• lee22sharon 1,419 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 9:40 PM

  Ref:  Green Speeds.

  Don't know what stimp is don't really care.  WGT has their plan in effect.  Doesn't matter what we want!

  However!, if I were to have what I want, The green speed would be announced each day what it will be for every green:  champion, tourney, fast, standard.  Then for added excitement you can add in very dry, dry, regular, damp, wet. on top of the named green speed.  Na!, won't happen to easy.   my nickle

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 9:44 PM

  lee22sharon:

  Then for added excitement you can add in very dry, dry, regular, damp, wet. on top of the named green speed.

  This worked for Links. With 3 different hardnesses (soft, medium, hard) and 3 different speeds  (slow, medium and fast) they had 9 different combinations. This would be great if they did that here. It would end a lot of confusion.

• godelescher 636 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 10:01 PM

  YankeeJim:

  Not asking you to buy it, that's what he said

  That's not what he said. Read it again. This is what he said:

   

  green speeds:

  we have the ability to set our greens to a multitude of different stimp settings, 7.5... 10.0... etc.;  and those "ranges" are grouped into categories;  

  so a setting such as "Tournament" will span a 1.0 stimp range (i.e. 12.0 - 13.0)

  but when we setup the tournaments... we set them to even values (so 12.0 or 13.0 rather than 12.4)  ;  so you will see difference within the label based on that range.

   

  It's not at all clear what he was talking about, but it had nothing to do with why there is one name for two speeds.

  There is no mention of AS or multi player games anywhere. He is talking about tournament speed in regular play vs. tournament speed in tournaments. 

  The words "legend" or "tour master" are nowhere in the reply.

  Maybe he misunderstood the question. 

• andyson 6,415 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 10:05 PM

  YankeeJim:

  OK, replace AS with mixed tiers such as you get in an All Players tournament. Same difference.

  He never mentioned mixed tiers either.

  YankeeJim:

  You still haven't addressed the in between values.

  Where did he say they used in between values?  That's where you are reading too much in his statement.

  This makes sense? 

  

  Remember when Legend tier was first introduced we got Champion (13.0) greens.  WGT was scrambling and backpedaling based on the feedback.  They needed a quick solution and creating a new green speed name for Legends was a lot more work and would delay introduction of the fixes.  They needed to put the fires out.  So 12.0 also became Tournament.  It appeased the masses.  That's what I think happened.

• alosso 21,060 Posts

  Wed, Jul 4 2012 10:23 PM

  YankeeJim:

  If you're a TM in an all TM tournament you will see what we call the TM speed. As a Legend in an all Legend tournament you would see that Legend speed. Mix the 2 tiers together and you get something in between that changes based on whatever variable number the game is setting for those speeds.

  This would be in contradiction of the FAQs ==>

  They state that the highest tier's green speed will be used.

  Alas, if Legends state that the speed drops, I can't argue against it.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Thu, Jul 5 2012 5:32 AM

  godelescher:

  so a setting such as "Tournament" will span a 1.0 stimp range (i.e. 12.0 - 13.0)

  but when we setup the tournaments... we set them to even values (so 12.0 or 13.0 rather than 12.4)  ;  so you will see difference within the label based on that range.

  godelescher:

  It's not at all clear what he was talking about,

  Tournaments get set up with even (whole) values. Do you get that?

  A setting of "tournament" will be between these even numbers? Do you get that?

  Now, if you're not playing in a tournament what are you playing? The majority of the time it will be a multi player game. I used AS as an example. Whatever you are playing it has stimp values between these even numbers. That's where "you will see difference within the label based on that range."

  It's not unreasonable to infer that there are 2 conditions involved-tournament play and non-tournament play. Andy calls it reading too much into it. I call it a logical determination.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Thu, Jul 5 2012 5:39 AM

  andyson:

  Where did he say they used in between values?  That's where you are reading too much in his statement.

  See G's transcript above of what CN said.

  " so a setting such as "Tournament" will span a 1.0 stimp range (i.e. 12.0 - 13.0)"

  To me, spanning a range means there's fractions involved. You can't have an even (whole) number between 2 whole numbers 1 whole number apart. This would mean that unless you're in tournament play where the even number is used, you're playing on something in between the 2 values. Multiplayer formats use this. This is a logical inference and, IMO, is where the confusion lies as there's no suitable way to actually name what speed you're playing on. A stimp value in place of the name would fix this.