Forums

Precision vs. Forgiveness??

• Sastradamus 10 Posts

  Mon, Jul 19 2010 11:11 AM

  Hello everyone,

  I'm curious what the difference between the two is. Logically, I expect forgiveness to be a reduction in the amount of variance experienced when you miss a 'ding' from your intended target and precision to be if you hit a ding, does your shot fly exactly as you had aimed (taking wind out of it of course).

   

  Basically, I'm wondering why precise clubs appear to be better than forgiving clubs. I've noticed they cost more and noticed many of the top players are using the clubs with max precision over those with forgiveness. I mean, unless they're hitting dings about 90% of the time, isn't it smarter to protect yourself on the occasions you miss? Afterall, if you're hitting dings then the shot should be pretty darn close to where you were aiming anyways and be a pretty good shot. Curious for other people's thoughts.

• overthetop2 192 Posts

  Mon, Jul 19 2010 5:09 PM

  From what i've heard (ie: this is kinda what WGTNiv said):

  Precision works like a circle of accuracy (in other words, the consistency of the club).  When you aim your pointer at a certain point, there's a certain circle of error within which the ball can go even if you ding it.  High precision clubs make this circle of error very small (or it greatly increases your chance of the ball going to the centre of the circle, i'm not sure which one as i haven't played the clubs).  This circle also exists when you miss the ding, which is why you miss the ding on some shots and they go pretty much where you wanted anyway, and other times when you miss the ding they go well off target.  In other words, if you prefer the random number generator not to send your ball flying wide when you ding it, high precision clubs are the way to go.

  But what would i know, i haven't bought any clubs yet (thinking of though hence why i study them a bit :P).

• Sastradamus 10 Posts

  Mon, Jul 19 2010 5:17 PM

  That makes sense but then what does forgiveness do? I assumed forgiveness would essentially make the circle smaller when you don't ding which is also what precision is doing??

• WGTniv 1,788 Posts

  Tue, Jul 20 2010 1:21 PM

  Forgiveness shifts the precision circle left or right (and usually short) depending on how much you mishit and what the forgiveness rating of the club is.  Clubs with lesser forgiveness ratings shift the circle left/right more on mishits.

  This is why (especially on low precision clubs) you can mishit slightly right of the mark and have the ball go left instead.  Mishitting right shifts the circle to the right, but part of the circle is still "leftover" on the left side of the flag, so it has the potential to land there.

• vanceesharp 12 Posts

  Tue, Jul 20 2010 2:21 PM

  Sastradamus,

  I understand the points you made in your post. I have owned or rented nearly every club available in the pro shop. My average when turning master went from 65.5 to 72.5 very rapidly. I was using the full set of Rapture V2 Pings and a redwood putter as a pro. The driver, woods, and irons were forgiving but the wedges and putter were precise. I needed more distance on my drives so I bought the Taylor master set and upgraded the driver to the TRI R9. The swing meters were so fast that I could never ding with them. I bought the GI-3S balls to slow that down to a reasonable degree. Then I got rid of the PING wedges and the 3H 22 rescue club and got Taylor masters and a 64 tour pro. This helped my precision around the green but the redwood was still too precise and if I didn't ding it exactly would miss putts, so I opted for the Daytona. Now I still miss the excellent mark alot but hopefully will be able to drop my average back into the 60's. Maybe this will help you. I'm just telling you my experience. Keep on practicing and playing WGT golf!

• TracyMax 2,361 Posts

  Mon, Jul 26 2010 11:43 AM

  What is frustrating about the clubs is that they consistantly hit shorter than they should by 10-15 yards. Even considering the wind, (which is an issue for another post), the clubs hit short. Yes I have beginner clubs, but that should not have an impact on whether the clubs hit the length they're suppose to. For those of us unemployed  we don't  have the option of "buying" better equipment by purchasing credits. This is a game,ok I'll never be a "master" I am ok with that. I'd just like things to work like they're suppose too. There are holes you cannot reach with the beginner clubs in par--that' s not right. .All of you that "live" on this game and spend money purchasing this or that should be less critical and more helpful. There are a lot of good tips in  the forums, but there is a lot of condescension too. We all want to have fun and do, even if it's at different levels.

• Sastradamus 10 Posts

  Mon, Jul 26 2010 11:54 AM

  Tracy,

  Just a couple of things I found:

  1. Look into surveys to save enough to buy clubs/balls. That is what I've found.
  2. Even as master with clubs and balls, there are a few par 4s that can't be reached in 2 easily  unless you have favorable wind and some luck. Don't forget as you move up all aspects of the game become more difficult including teeing off further back.

  Regarding the clubs being short, do you mean they are landing short or landing and rolling short? Anything less than an 8 iron usually will land a bit short regardless of wind and roll and you got to take into account if its an uphill shot. Hang in there and eventually you start to spot which holes need to be played further/short on approach shots.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Jul 26 2010 12:20 PM

  TracyMax:

  What is frustrating about the clubs is that they consistantly hit shorter than they should by 10-15 yards.

  The distances of your clubs are not in the air distances. They include the roll at the end and that's based on no wind and flat ground. Wind obviously changes that but setting that aside, like sas says above, the elevation (up and down hill) will also affect this. Try taking one more club than you think you should and see what happens. A lot of times taking a longer club and swinging less than full will be your best shot. 

  Not being able to reach certain greens in regulation means you have to manage your game to combat this. Instead of trying something you know won't work try laying up and playing for par. Now, when you lay up, chose the distance away from the hole that you are comfortable with and play to that spot. Don't just whack away, plan the shot. This will give you good practice at the important part of the game-getting your approach shots close to the pin. It will help and your game will progress accordingly. Just learn the clubs you have, even if they're shorter than what you think they should be, and manage your game accordingly.

  There are easy way to get enough credits to upgrade your driver, too. This makes it a little easier if you can get off the tee in decent fashion. GL 

• TracyMax 2,361 Posts

  Mon, Jul 26 2010 12:47 PM

  Ok what surveys? By the way how did you include part of my message in the text?

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Jul 26 2010 2:08 PM

  TracyMax:

  Ok what surveys? By the way how did you include part of my message in the text?

  When you reply to a post directly there is a "quote" box in the lower left corner. Anything you highlight in the post you are responding to will be automatically inserted in your response when you click this button.

  As for the surveys, for starters they are plastered all over the site in the headers (ads.) In fact, there is one right now that says EARN WGT CREDITS IN FUN WAYS at the top of my page now. Otherwise, you can see them here ...   

  http://www.wgt.com/user/offers.aspx