Forums

tier changs

• johnniewalker76 526 Posts

  Fri, Feb 14 2014 4:53 AM

  what average points do you need to change to tour legend ?

• ApexPC 3,164 Posts

  Fri, Feb 14 2014 6:42 PM

  500 ranked rounds as a Legend, and a scoring average of 60.00 or less.

• Stip 457 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 8:06 AM

  First and foremost, my apology to Jonnie & Apex. My intent was not to sponge off your thread, however, this seems the only route for me to get on here.

  I hope "WGTicon" or whom ever reads this, because you have some explaining to do!

  Item #1....I have read (on several occasions) in this vast crater you call Forums, "if a lower tier player defeats a higher tier player in Match Play, the lower tier player's average will drop."  I understand members have made this statement, so I am asking if this is valid? For example, I know (1st hand) of the exact scenario occurring multiple times and the lower tier player's average remains the same. Stop right there! They were honest wins by the lower tier player. No conspiracy was concocted!

  Please advise.

   

  Item #2...I cannot figure out how to start a new thread in this Forum section. This fact leads me to believe I am on the Moderator's list. As a member since Feb2009 and less then a handful of posts, replies I should say, here (this Forum page) you, WGT, better have a damn good reason to prevent me from starting a new thread.  

  Please advise.

   

  Sincerely,

  Stip

• ScottHope 10,646 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 8:28 AM

  

  ↓↓↓ Thank you Stip. ↓↓↓

• alosso 21,094 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 9:23 AM

  Stip:

  Item #1....I have read (on several occasions) in this vast crater you call Forums, "if a lower tier player defeats a higher tier player in Match Play, the lower tier player's average will drop."  I understand members have made this statement, so I am asking if this is valid? For example, I know (1st hand) of the exact scenario occurring multiple times and the lower tier player's average remains the same. Stop right there! They were honest wins by the lower tier player. No conspiracy was concocted!

  Please advise.

  WGT won't. You might want to search their news of the second half of 2012 for any notice on "anti-sandbagging action".

  The tiering process has been their secret as long as I have been playing, so no details and no numbers have ever been given by them. Only scarcely have they pointed to the average and round number lists given by the users as "good guesses". Alas, I'm sure that these sets of data and procedure description are correct. Others have minor flaws.

  Concerning match play, I can confirm that my TM average dropped substantially by each of my two match play wins against Legends in 2012. Also have I seen at least one user advancing from Master to Legend with no single strokeplay round last year, probably only by matchplay. There is some suspicion though that terms may have changed in the meantime, perhaps some matches have been excluded?

  No intention to offend anybody with the following:

  Concerning your scenario notice, I'm afraid to say that I doubt such reports regarding their precision and completeness, e.g.:

  - has the average been observed vigilantly, making sure to know the number exactly before and after the match? Have the relevant pages been updated?

  - was it rated or challenge matches, opposite to practice matches?

  Last but not least, we don't know if all rated matches are included in the count today.

• courteneyfish 15,796 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 9:37 AM

  If you ask WGTIcon nicely he'll sort it so you can start threads :-)

• Stip 457 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 10:45 AM

  To ScottHope,

  Thank you for opening my eyes. I sit corrected and my deepest apology to WGT. All these years I have been "clicking" on the Re: title not the category.

  Have a gr8 day m8

• Stip 457 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 10:53 AM

  to alosso,

  I also have noticed the speed of advancement for some versus others. In the case I spoke about, the lower tier average was a nice even number (and remains a nice even number) making it easy to note. The Match Play games were all ranked and sandbagging should not be considered. On the surface, it seems all members are not held to the same requirements and that was the point of my question.

  Thank you for your reply alosso and it is duly noted.

• Stip 457 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 10:57 AM

  Courtneyfish,

  You are absolutely correct and 99.9% of the time I am, honest. I have apologized to WGT a couple replies above.

  Thank you for keeping me straight.

• Chinajohn 1,190 Posts

  Sat, Feb 15 2014 7:46 PM

  Stip:

  ....

  Item #1....I have read (on several occasions) in this vast crater you call Forums, "if a lower tier player defeats a higher tier player in Match Play, the lower tier player's average will drop."  I understand members have made this statement, so I am asking if this is valid? For example, I know (1st hand) of the exact scenario occurring multiple times and the lower tier player's average remains the same. Stop right there! They were honest wins by the lower tier player. No conspiracy was concocted!

  Please advise.

  ...

  As Alosso has said, WGT won't answer this question, they never do, it would appear to be policy to keep the details of advancing tiers secret, probably for good reasons.

  That said the members on these forums have figured it out with a reasonable degree of accuracy, but perhaps, some background may make things a little clearer.

  Back in the year dot, WGT was created the average was a simple mathematic average and all was well, but then sandbaggers arrived and the masses complained, so WGT acted making things confusing, (VERY). (In those days it would appear they responded to their customers requests).

  So now we have the present system, averages are calculated to three decimal places so to track yours you must use 4 decimals. Next the anti-sandbagger system was enhanced (and continues to change without notice), but the best we (others much more math savvy than I) can figure is this:

  Every time you beat a higher ranked player in MP (not sure about AS) then your average comes down by a set amount. However this reduction gets less over the subsequent 20 - 25 ranked rounds. If in this intervening time (20 - 25 rounds) you play a normal stroke play round your adjusted average may be counteracted by the reduction in effect of the reduction in your average from the win in MP, (still with me?), this makes it complicated. If you then add to this several more wins in MP, the effects of which will all be reducing at different rates dependent on when in the last 20 - 25 rounds that win was achieved, then all of a sudden your average is a mystery known only to Zeus!

  Confused? You will be!

  Good luck!