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WGT Ryder Cup 2018

• 11BC2 555 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 4:23 PM

  It's unethical to change rules mid tournament w/out the acceptance of all the players.  If there were no rules at the beginning then the question becomes, did any people play matches with a 90 second shot clock during the tournament?

  Basically it comes down to this:

  People either honor a 90 second shot clock and play the game or they refuse to use a 90 second shot clock and forfeit the match.  Anything else is BLATANT CHEATING.

• DodgyPutter 4,690 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 4:29 PM

  PAULFINN52:

  90 secs is the norm as far as i know but i may be wrong yes? and the only problem with players sorting out shot clocks is we are all not the same,i like 90 secs but very rarely go over 60 but its a comfort in case i need it so leaving it to the players could get be tricky,

  plus i havent contradicted as i see it anything simon has said,i was merely trying to give some advice on this situation,

  Ok but he has said he wants 60sec so you continually suggesting 90sec is the norm sort of is contradicting him/undermining him.

  There seems to be some sort of idea that your wc has been run smoothly on 90sec throughout and that's because it's in the rules.

  I can tell you for sure that the clock in the WC isn't universally liked, it is successful as it it's the way you want it and those that don't like it accept it.  I just read the WC rules I was sent and didn't see a default clock mentioned, I think you changed the default from 60sec to 90sec this year, actually it was done very informally on page 33/34 of the thread I just found it.

  Your reason for changing it wasn't that the 60sec default didn't work and it's hardly the big set in stone thing it's made out to be. 

  "What shot timer must we use?" jim

  "its purely optional jim.

   i always go 90 secs  with maximum timeouts,i probably only need 40 to 50 but im easy going and in no rush.

  if players agree to use 45secs its ok with me ,

  decide that when you are arranging your match"

  and then

  "I'm a bit confused here Paul, I thought we always did 60 seconds(as per the recommended rules) unless the two players in a game agree on 90 seconds. I thought the Default Timer for World Cup was 60 seconds.

  Correct me if I'm wrong.

  Thanks, KP"

  "it was kp but as i said i would go for 90 secs to be on the safe side

  more players in this time and wouldnt really matter to me so roll with it  mate"

  and the "rule" is then 90sec, it really doesn't make it the "norm".  I mean no criticism with this, it's just it's being used as a stick to beat Simon with.  The reason there's no fuss about it in the WC is those of us who don't like it still got on with the competition and moaned about it in privicy :-) 

  What we have here is two teams and the best players, not however many it was and all sorts of levels of ability.

  So all these assumptions, and there seem to be many,  are apparently based on the chats above.

• fmagnets 3,640 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 4:52 PM

  WaLk0fLiFe:

  60 sec happens to be ur pref

  As I said, 60s is not my preference, just an attempt at a reasonable suggestion for a middle ground for the purposes of mutual agreement. Exactly as reasonable as birchi choosing that number for a rule in case of indecision, not least because it is WGT's default setting.

  We have one of the slowest players on our side, and you have one of the fastest on your side. Do you honestly think a rule would have been put in place last night that could have hurt the European player for a match scheduled this afternoon in order to benefit a European player yet to schedule their match? It's idiotic when you think about it, but it really seems like you haven't thought about it in any depth.

   

• jgr123 49 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 4:59 PM

  So far i'm not very impressed with this so called Elitest Ryder Cup,it's not a patch on the Southern England Links internal Ryder Cup  which has an all round better format with the most talented players in WGT .

• WaLk0fLiFe 285 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 5:06 PM

  fmagnets:

  WaLk0fLiFe:

  60 sec happens to be ur pref

  As I said, 60s is not my preference, just an attempt at a reasonable suggestion for a middle ground for the purposes of mutual agreement. Exactly as reasonable as birchi choosing that number for a rule in case of indecision, not least because it is WGT's default setting.

  We have one of the slowest players on our side, and you have one of the fastest on your side. Do you honestly think a rule would have been put in place last night that could have hurt the European player for a match scheduled this afternoon in order to benefit a European player yet to schedule their match? It's idiotic when you think about it, but it really seems like you haven't thought about it in any depth.

   

   

  pointless to continue this...

• 11BC2 555 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 5:16 PM

  Fmags, you've recently won the Live US Amateur Championship and are arguably one of the best if not The Best player in WGT History.  I've seen you post -17 and -18 unders in 15 second shot clocks in the past......So a few questions for you Fmags:

   

  Are you incapable of playing high level golf with a 90 second shot clock?

  Don't you want to afford your opponent the best opportunity to play good golf?

  How many times do you actually think Jason will use up the entire 90 second shot clock? (In a recent match he averaged 28seconds per shot).

   

  Again, given there were no official rules at the start of the tournament, in conjunction with other people having already played 90 second shot clock, not to mention players or teams didn't agree to a 60 second shot clock, I'm a bit curious how this is even an issue.

   

• Young46 1,298 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 6:07 PM

  I'm done debating this issue; I've lost all interest in playing this match so I've just told Fmagnets to just pick whatever shot clock he fancy's.

• carlosdev 2,559 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 6:20 PM

  When the game started between Fmag n young46, there was no clock setting.  So Mag came with the default wgt setting. Then young46 insisted to get a 90 clock n mag agreed to it without any drama

  Right now Mag wants a 60 clock where young46 has to agree too because without any question in R1, Mag agreed to his choice. Why young46 wants it to be worked with his way always? 

  Now regarding the conclusion of clock set up which wasn’t set up at the beginning of this tournament, Simon came up with a final choice as he’s the man behind this tournament and also to avoid any further drama  to have a seamless n flawless running ahead. 

  Rules are meant to the obeyed n if there wasn’t one, well there is one now. Accept it n move on. 

  :)  :) 

  - Carl

• fmagnets 3,640 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 6:24 PM

  Well assuming you want straight answers rather than just making an unnecessary fuss:

  - Are you incapable of playing high level golf with a 90 second shot clock?

  No, just fractionally less capable than with a shorter timer. Similarly Jason is perfectly capable of high level play with a 60s, but perhaps fractionally less capable that with 90s.

  - Don't you want to afford your opponent the best opportunity to play good golf?

  Yes, and I've said as much privately and publicly. I would also hope my opponent would want to afford me the best opportunity, and is why we'll hopefully agree on something away from all this nonsense.

  - How many times do you actually think Jason will use up the entire 90 second shot clock? (In a recent match he averaged 28seconds per shot).

  No idea, but 7 timeouts were declined so maybe more than 7.

  - Again, given there were no official rules at the start of the tournament, in conjunction with other people having already played 90 second shot clock, not to mention players or teams didn't agree to a 60 second shot clock, I'm a bit curious how this is even an issue.

  Correct. No rules at the start. Nothing to say it should be 90, nothing to say it should be 60. Some matches have been 90, some have been 60. It's up to the players to agree. I really don't think the clock in our match is an issue at all and I'm sure we will agree what to do amicably. Thanks for your baffling degree of concern :-)

   

• f1dget 4,074 Posts

  Tue, Nov 13 2018 9:19 PM

  Does anyone here know that we have had 3 matches in Round 2 UEL which have produced results and played in very good spirits? Yes 3 matches in which the players have posted there results only to be over shadowed by this nonsense.

  Well done to Shankette, Luiscraveiro, Jayw4862, Andivo, Frenchconnect & Duffputt. Great effort guys and on a very tough set. Very well played.

  We still have 7 more games to be completed in this round. Do we want our players playing under a cloud of controversy which is sure to affect there game?. At the moment i am really feeling for them, We have all given up our time to play in this wonderful event. Some players just want to play and keep out of all the bull$hit that comes with the job. We need to respect that, this tournament should be remembered for all the right reasons and not the wrong one's.

  We have been in discussion about what has happened via alternative means. This does not need to be made public. We are resolving the issues best we can, so please may i ask for this argument to cease.

  Thank you.