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Re: Tiered Up To Legend - Equipment

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Tue, Mar 24 2015 2:24 PM (27 replies)
  • SacredCow40
    43 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 8:52 AM

    SeabrookFlash:

    I agree with you regarding the additional cost of balls.  I too played with the WGT ball as long as I possibly could before finally deciding to change.  Fortunately for me, I can usually earn enough free credits to keep me from buying balls every week.  Although it is getting harder and harder to do. Good luck with your game and congratulations for your move up to Legend.

    i earnt some credits from weekly tourneys, but that was in masters and TM category. Different ball game in 'L' I imagine. Thank you for your kind words. I will see you round the traps. haha

  • Jimbog1964
    8,378 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 9:46 AM

    SweetiePie:
    ``````and so Mr. Cow, as I was saying, be sensitive to what scores you post because they can haunt you when you begin to knock on the TL door. It is interesting to me to read comments that tell you "it doesn't matter", "don't bother with it", "500 this" , "saturation that", 'turn in those 75's", and so on. It is of interest because the same people giving this unrealistic advice are the ones, aware; keeping exact detail, even to the point of spreadsheets dealing with the nature of it all while telling you it doesn't matter....it matters..... 

    Different takes on it and fair enough, but I am one who would absolutely say do not worry about what you turn in. I never have kept a SS, and my notes easily fit on one side of A4.

     Those notes are my yardage chart for irons which is nice to check when needed I find; also have my wedge yardages from 4 through 107 yards really (well a few numbers that I massage around with varying shot types / spin settings); lastly I have a very basic % speed reminder for the varying speeds that come up in CC / RG comps.  

    I never have and have zero intention of playing practice rounds more than three times a year, just use those for mapping after a club swap.  All I see is less XPs with those to protect what some WGT average  / tired from day 1 stats- my view of it.  I do not have 60% 1 putt, but not far.  I see some comment on their 70 1 putts, and then I look at their score history and its no wonder with what they turn in from where.  Comes to single play real comps hardly ever see them as off shooting 26 in multi-play somewhere easy.  That's not knocking the red tee average chase at all that is separate and this is away from that.  

    I should add that I am not knocking practice either of course, just that practice rounds I can't personally be assed with for this game, and frankly poor scores make squat difference unless you need that badge or are in a red tee average chase comp.

    My first RR as Legend as was 72 at Andys, and that was my average.  That is when I came to the forums thinking WTF, and Lizard gave me great advice on mapping.  I worked at that and by the time I hit TL I was breaking 60 at Oakmpnt (sometimes).  Once the 500 RR saturation point is reached those old scores are simply zapped out of the calculation.  I had lots of bad scores, and so my average plummeted fast as they got zapped to the ether.  I also had all the XP from those scores handed in :)....These days I really only WD from RGs if I blow out early, and zero chance of getting close to the economic limit.  CC stuff is usually round robin and single play stuff and in all conditions, and I never WD from that - really would be poor form.

    Below the headline WGT average the other WGT stats will lurch forward in their own slow WGT poor way, slowly, roughly in the right direction remaining too antiquated largely.

    Yep IMO 100% forget all about average, and just fire away, and enjoy.  Shoot 110 at Oak tomorrow and it will have zero impact on how long you take to reach TL (if you care).  Choose not to hand that 110 in, and it will delay you leveling up.

    Play all the courses as a L in real conditions too IMO.  Get to TL, and the conditions are only tougher on real course comps.  Do not make the mistake of comparing L leader-boards to TL ones for that reason.

    PS - yes my average is low, but look how many RRs I have.  I am a campaigner for a rolling average and a new tier, but WGT make it so I saturated:).....My score history is not anywhere near that same as anyone is not often playing to their "saturated" average in the high level comps..I say new tier so as to leave the red T comp alone and those that like saturated stuff too - loads elsewhere but just said that as not an elitist thing nor wishing to get in the way of what others like in any way.

     

  • SacredCow40
    43 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 12:08 PM

    I know your essay is more directed towards Sweetpie's post, but I thought I would say you make a great point about just stroke play and forgetting about average as you will level up quicker and it won't matter as those bad scores will be wiped fromyour 500RRs. One thing I am totally unfamiliar with is the Red Tee comp that you constantly write about. Is this people (L's and TLs) who set up CC tourney with easy tees and then hit screamers and gain very low averages as a result? 

  • Jimbog1964
    8,378 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 12:27 PM

    SacredCow40:
    I know your essay is more directed towards Sweetpie's post, but I thought I would say you make a great point about just stroke play and forgetting about average as you will level up quicker and it won't matter as those bad scores will be wiped fromyour 500RRs. One thing I am totally unfamiliar with is the Red Tee comp that you constantly write about. Is this people (L's and TLs) who set up CC tourney with easy tees and then hit screamers and gain very low averages as a result? 

    Only directed at SP as to a difference of opinion about whether to forget to about average or not.  Clearly I would say forget all about it, and the rest was just to demonstrate why to you more than anything.

    I say red tee comp but really it's just that some people choose to really chase down average score shooting off red tees.  There is absolutely nothing wrong with that BTW, and some are having at the top of the TL averages chasing it - all good as that's their fun.

    Some have always (before red tees) worn an average like a badge anyway - why have to ask them and up to them.  Personally I think getting the TL badge by being able to create your own adventure (set up red tee CC comps at some easy course and learning only that is a bit daft), but WGTs decision.  TLs that want to play red tees and chase it down no issue with at all and more power to them

    You have all the inf now, and you will find your way as to what you enjoy.  In the end it's your leisure time, and provided you enjoy it is the main thing:)  If you want to be able to compete against the best in real comps, then clearly you need to do a bit more that's all. I am no great player, but I have come across red tee, low average, great stats specials (got to TL really playing easy stuff), and some of those I have seen just quit as get them on a real course in real conditions, and totally lost against anyone that can actually play half well........No way am I suggesting that some red tee only people can't play either, but some are real paper planes too, well, away from BPB F9 at best.................

    Happy hitting whatever you choose though:)

  • SacredCow40
    43 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 1:23 PM

    Jimbog1964:

    You have all the inf now, and you will find your way as to what you enjoy.  In the end it's your leisure time, and provided you enjoy it is the main thing:)  If you want to be able to compete against the best in real comps, then clearly you need to do a bit more that's all. I am no great player, but I have come across red tee, low average, great stats specials (got to TL really playing easy stuff), and some of those I have seen just quit as get them on a real course in real conditions, and totally lost against anyone that can actually play half well........No way am I suggesting that some red tee only people can't play either, but some are real paper planes too, well, away from BPB F9 at best.................

    Happy hitting whatever you choose though:)

    I just struck my first RR round as a legend and hit a +2 at St Andies. Now if that didn't bring me down to earth. Feel like a hacker all over again. I would average for a 18 rounder there as a TM -6 to -9 and now +2. Now I have 74 average! haha. Mind you it was high wind and if I had practiced there as a legend before hand I would know some important distance and mapping considerations. But what the heck. It'll be snubbed out in time as my 500 is saturated or however you should term it.

    Regarding the red tee thing, I thought the whole point of being legend or whatever tier you are at is to hit off from the tier's given tee. I can't see myself ever doing the red tee thing and have that record influencing my average. That's an integrity thing as far as I'm concerned.Whatever rocks their boat.  How can you become a better legend hitting much less than the prescribed distances. I think you are on the money in everything you wrote. As you mentioned on a real course under real conditions that sets the real talent apart. 

    Happy hitting too Jim and once again thanks for the great info. 

    Cheers.

  • SweetiePie
    4,925 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 1:28 PM

    SacredCow40:

    Hey gang, I wasn't expecting it so soon, but just tiered up to legend. In fact I think it was ridiculously quick. I beat a few of legends in match play, killed some courses and zoom. I'm here after just 300 something rounds - playing just 4 months.

    `````and so, I made my suggestion about carefully posting score, based upon the above opening comment....I assumed that your average and speed of elevation was of importance to you....if not, disregard and follow J-Bog's lead. I have maybe 30 ranked rounds from the reds. I also have close to 4,000 ranked rounds from the tips of whatever tier I was in. While it is true, that to many, score average is un-important, they are in fact habitually moaning about it, wanting to change this, that and the next thing because the chase of a low one doesn't fit their play habits and is a thorn in their side, or a stone in their shoe..:-}...They don't care a durn about it, yet type all day about it  ~ SP ~ 

  • SacredCow40
    43 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 1:52 PM

    SweetiePie:

    `````and so, I made my suggestion about carefully posting score, based upon the above opening comment....I assumed that your average and speed of elevation was of importance to you....if not, disregard and follow J-Bog's lead. I have maybe 30 ranked rounds from the reds. I also have close to 4,000 ranked rounds from the tips of whatever tier I was in. While it is true, that to many, score average is un-important, they are in fact habitually moaning about it, wanting to change this, that and the next thing because the chase of a low one doesn't fit their play habits and is a thorn in their side, or a stone in their shoe..:-}...They don't care a durn about it, yet type all day about it  ~ SP ~ 

    I'll be frank about it...tiering up so quickly has probably been more of a thorn in my side.  My clubs are as good as hackers at Legend level.  I can see the appeal of sandbagging, keeping the average above the next level,  high leveling tour pro and sticking to killing it. I remember when I was on the brink of going to master tier, I asked the guys in my game. 'Is their a way I can just sit here at this average and make most out of these clubs and distances. I can't see my game getting much better teeing from here and with these clubs'? And one replied' Yeh don't play'!

    I fell hook line and sinker into the perfect wgt client profile.  Tiered and leveled up relatively quick with very few RRs, had to buy as I tiered up, burning my pocket book as you might call it hehe. Now I'm at the stage again where buying new equipment is almost a necessity to see any real improvement at this tier. Come in sucker! But its been fun. 

     

  • Jimbog1964
    8,378 Posts
    Tue, Mar 24 2015 2:24 PM

    The advice I gave was to the OP only who is a Legend already, not to a new L59 M who can pick off hack Ls.  Not saying the OP is that at all, but people have got their too early they feel that way.  Anti sandbagging measures that also do not work perfectly for the uninitiated etc..

    Now at L level my advice stands to just play and enjoy.  500s RRs until saturation is a long time for most, and once saturated the bad early doors scores are booted from the calc.  I could shoot 180 and my average will not change, and in fact did so once in a CC comp (long story but fun comp).

    Yes I would love to see a new tier that only had rolling averages and stats from real courses in SP mode that got reset each season say.  To even get that average a certain (manageable for the majority) amount of rounds from say 90% of the courses would need to played.  I certainly feel that the current average system is only good for badge wearers or people that wish to chase averages off red tees.  I am not looking to stop any of that, just saying that there are some who would like a way to get away from the WGT average system.  That's a once TL thing, nothing to do with the OP.  It's also not looking v likely to happen, and so for now we have an average system which is, for the most part, beyond meaningless even before you saturate at TL..  

    Now have a true just play average,  and you will get to watch some BoF F9 special paper plane get annoyed cos they never bothered to learn, yet have a low average badge,  is funny though:).....Averages here count for not much all too often.  Nothing to stop a Legend playing other games to learn a course, and going on a RG riot for 500  RRs* mind if that is what they want, but 500 + is a long time to learn and get plenty of RGs in too........They are harder once TL.  What is absolutely pointless is protecting an average score in WGT land, unless you are chasing down the WGT TL average listings board in the red tee section :).....Away from of course keeping it artificially high in any tier (to go sandbagging).

    EDIT * - Some have been pushed up early for doing that although probably all M/A wonkers who deserved all they got, and they leave to go and work on the next account usually anyway :)

    SacredCow40:
    Now I have 74 average! haha

    Mine was 72 round 1 as L, and so same path one suspects.  Other end of the 500 RRs (9 holes count as 1 rmbr) go shoot a 25 at Merion F9 as an experienced Legend of real tees, and watch that average PLUMMET:) and you have that tourney XP in the bag, NO downside to this approach as opposed to taking less XPs for same practice - explain the downside to handing in cards for L if there is please.  Use practice mode for mapping and to get a troublesome hole of if really need to / sparingly other times is my advice:)

     In fact the people a protected average would help is MPC sharks if you ever chose that.  You are fully entitled to play how you like and improve that way.  Those that protected everything will be whinging they are not high enough level to get something oftentimes. Choices but mine were gung ho go for it, still easily hit TL at L91 and v happy to do so.  After that I also (LOL) disagree with how long people wait for a couple of bits, but choices and that's nothing to do with watching average score to stop it getting in the way of reaching TL as it absolutely does not :)

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