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Tiered Up To Legend - Equipment

• Jimbog1964 8,378 Posts

  Mon, Mar 23 2015 7:13 PM

  SacredCow40:

  So basically once someone reaches 500 RR, the average is not derived from their current tier 'best of' RRs but from their overall best 500 rounds. So at round 499 for instance your average is derived from the best RRs from your current tier then once you get to 500 it switches to your average from your best 500 RRs. Do I have it?

  No read what I wrote again word for word:)

  Try this also:

  Your average reset when you hit Legend.  In 500  RRs time (excluding BoP3/ 5 which make squat difference) you will saturate.  Thus after 499 RRs (and same at 500) your average is an average of every RR you submitted as a Legend (ex those BoP3/5s as ever).  Now get to your  501st RR PLAYED AS A LEGEND (still always ex BoP3/5 as ever) your average can only go down, nothing to do with what you shot before Legend.  Say you got to 500 RRs with an average of 70, and 501st RR shoot 180 your average would not be hurt.  At 500 RRs as a Legend you will be said to be saturated, and so only good RRs that you shoor within Legend tier will count, and to move the average one will need to be better than the worst in that 500..See that FAQ with a link to a good thread on it:)

  RGs - Ready Go (premium tournaments).  See tournaments top of page, and under that the RG option.  Obviously look for Legend Tier ONLY RGs to see what the fashion is:)

  As hackman123 said saturation is the reason you see really quite silly numbers next to TLs .  No point confusing things but TL will also saturate when you get to that and play another 500 RRs within Legend Tier :)............

  Other reasons for whacko low averages exist of course such as only submitting real good scores from red tees at L or TL.  I hasten to say no offence to red tee people, just demonstrating how worthwhile the WGT average is (NOT LOL) for skill level if just go by that.  Want skill indications look past the average score and look at scores and where they were shot .....(RGs are usually considered harder as credits are on the line, and so the best in any given tier need to be beat to do OK).  Weekly comp etc scores are a good yardstick as well.  You will get some TLs commenting that can only regularly break par on Beth F9 low wind in their CC and even then play it mostly off the reds........Like I say nothing against red tee people, some are real good, just trying to say look past averages and even headline stats when deciding who to take advice from.  Seen plenty of Ls with crazy low averages and look at their score history and easy to see why (all easy multiplay stuff).  Not saying that TLs can't play but some in the TL league are paper planes too.  Conversely some Ls (even TLs) have whacko high averages, and use that as a disguise for MPC (Match play for credits).

  Just play and enjoy and forget all about average for a LONG time is my advice.  Personally I would (and I did) just hand in all the scores and take the XPs to level up.  Only comps I WD from now really are RGs (when past the economic limit but that's a RG only thing, lol)

  Also see this thread, and Alosso BTW really knows his stuff.  No offence to anyone else in the thread BTW just that I only quickly looked at what Alosso wrote and saw it to be perhaps pertinent and know he is always right:)

• SacredCow40 43 Posts

  Mon, Mar 23 2015 9:20 PM

  So it is 500 rounds within the Legend tier. Ha...  HAA! You did write that and I assumed 500 total rounds (all tiers) because it's a heck of a lot of rounds. Got it I think. Pretty complicated stuff well at least for me. 500 rounds would take months if not years to complete. I've played 300 something rounds in 4 months and I play a lot, so 500 rounds as a 'legend' is a fair wack. I'll check out that thread you linked.
  
  Is there no such thing as a stupid question? How do people know they are approaching 500 RRs as a legend. You would have to keep a manual tally, because only your total RRs (all tiers combined) show up in your stats. Am I right?

  I agree about forgeting about average because there is sandbagging and hitting off red tes etc. In fact I already have forgotten about it. My goal was to make Legend and I've done that, so now I can just sit back and enjoy it for what its worth. It's gonna take some getting used to in the initial stages. May be in years to come I might fancy progressing to TL. 

  Jim you are a WGT library man. Thank you for informing the simple likes of 'moi' about the intricate aspects of how averages work at this tier. My head is still in a whirlwind with your above post. Lots to decipher. Haha. Cheers. 

• Jimbog1964 8,378 Posts

  Mon, Mar 23 2015 9:47 PM

  SacredCow40:

  So it is 500 rounds within the Legend tier

  Yes

  And when you get to TL it all resets again for another 500 RRs until saturation within TL tier:)

  SacredCow40:

  Is there no such thing as a stupid question? How do people know they are approaching 500 RRs as a legend. You would have to keep a manual tally, because only your total RRs (all tiers combined) show up in your stats. Am I right?

  Manual tally of RRs that count (so ex Bof P3/5).  Now you understand saturation you will note that get there and good scores pushing out initial early doors poor scores will lead to marked changes upon saturation (e.g, my first RR as a Legend was 72 and so that was my average.  When I saturated and shot say a 57 I could see that change easy).  

  Different game now you are Legend, unless you become red tee central:).  Whatever you choose wish you every enjoyment on the journey:)

  Lastly take it you realise 9 holes count as a 1 x RR same as 18.  Thus shoot say a 26 at Beth F9 (probably easiest course at Legend with good gear from full length tees), and your average would be 52.  IMO though learn all the courses, but some are happy being one trick ponies......

• hakman123 2,119 Posts

  Mon, Mar 23 2015 10:37 PM

  SacredCow40:

  
  Is there no such thing as a stupid question? How do people know they are approaching 500 RRs as a legend. You would have to keep a manual tally, because only your total RRs (all tiers combined) show up in your stats. Am I right?

  100% correct.  The only way is to simply look at your stats and see how many RR's you have played as you level up. You can keep track of how many BOP3s and BOP5s you play - and you need to eliminate these rounds as they do not count.

  I take things to extremes - I have a few calculation spreadsheets where I muck around with wind allowances and other things - in amongst those I have a tally sheet where I enter every round I play (as mentioned above - doubling the 9 hole scores to convert them to 18 hole scores each time).

  This way I know exactly how many rounds I have played - I can see my average to 3 decimal places (or more - but not necessary). I can see when I have reached Saturation - and will also know the highest scores currently in my best 500 RR's - so I know what will make the average move and what will not.

  As I say - this is overkill and I do not recommend it for anyone but the truly insane such as myself.

  I DO recommend however - noting the RRs as you tier up each time. Then you know when you are getting close to saturation or the minimum rounds to tier up.

• SeabrookFlash 463 Posts

  Tue, Mar 24 2015 5:21 AM

  ABOUT THE BALL.... I used the WGT G-13 S ball at 99 credits per sleeve, until I reached Legend.  I reached a point where I felt that I needed to upgrade it and spend the credits in order to remain competitive. I have found that for myself that the Callaway level 45 Legend ball at 300 credits per sleeve is plenty of ball and is more economical than most of the Nike balls.  I am currently at level 100 and have been using it for a while. I would gift you a sleeve but for whatever reason, WGT doesn't allow this ball to be gifted.   I have tried some of the very pricy Nike balls and while they are good,  I don't believe that I lose anything with the Callaway ball that I use.   Just a thought.

• SweetiePie 4,925 Posts

  Tue, Mar 24 2015 6:20 AM

  ``````and so Mr. Cow, as I was saying, be sensitive to what scores you post because they can haunt you when you begin to knock on the TL door. It is interesting to me to read comments that tell you "it doesn't matter", "don't bother with it", "500 this" , "saturation that", 'turn in those 75's", and so on. It is of interest because the same people giving this unrealistic advice are the ones, aware; keeping exact detail, even to the point of spreadsheets dealing with the nature of it all while telling you it doesn't matter....it matters..... 

• SacredCow40 43 Posts

  Tue, Mar 24 2015 7:37 AM

  There is just so much to take in. I will make note of how many RRs I have up to this point, so when I do progress I will be able to see my total RRs in my stats and minus the RRs up to Legend level to know how much closer I am to saturation point. And as you mention I will get an inkling when of saturation point when I shoot a great round and the average dropping some.

  As I have stated already 500 RRs is a lot and I don't expect getting there until near the end of the year.  Especially since I will be incrementally buying new equipment. I knew early on the B of P3/5's don't count. And yes I learn all the courses and have no preference for one over the other although my 'best ofs' differ markedly . Those courses I find extra tough like Merrion, Olympic club and Pinehurst I play more to try to improve my best of round so it closes in on my Best of St Andrews and Kiawah rounds for instance.

  I keep and update a journal on each of the holes, my wedge distances for different shots and some basic putting guidelines etc All is set, except for the equipment, which I'm going to have to be patient with. When I upgrade wedges and I'm going to have to start all over again recording new wedge distances. But that's part of the fun.

• SacredCow40 43 Posts

  Tue, Mar 24 2015 7:43 AM

  hakman123:

  As I say - this is overkill and I do not recommend it for anyone but the truly insane such as myself.

  I DO recommend however - noting the RRs as you tier up each time. Then you know when you are getting close to saturation or the minimum rounds to tier up.

  Hakman, That's quite a hobby you got going with those spreadsheets, but it obviously adds to your enjoyment of the game. Nothing to be frowned upon. I have a crazy journal of wedge and individiual hole notes that looks like its been through the kiling fields and back again. 

  I have noted the RR as I tiered up to legend, so I'll use that to work out in months (if not years) when the saturation point will come into effect.

• SacredCow40 43 Posts

  Tue, Mar 24 2015 8:03 AM

   

  SeabrookFlash:

  ABOUT THE BALL.... I used the WGT G-13 S ball at 99 credits per sleeve, until I reached Legend.  I reached a point where I felt that I needed to upgrade it and spend the credits in order to remain competitive. I have found that for myself that the Callaway level 45 Legend ball at 300 credits per sleeve is plenty of ball and is more economical than most of the Nike balls.  I am currently at level 100 and have been using it for a while. I would gift you a sleeve but for whatever reason, WGT doesn't allow this ball to be gifted.   I have tried some of the very pricy Nike balls and while they are good,  I don't believe that I lose anything with the Callaway ball that I use.   Just a thought.

  I know the biggest concern I will have is with the ball. Tour-SD simply won't cut it on many uphill approach shots on championship greens. Look at Cabo Back 9 for instance. Now that requires super irons and great balls to keep many of them on.  

  I did record my usage of my Tour SD balls. In 14 days I have used 21 tour SD balls.  Maybe 1 or 2 went in drink or other lost. That works out as 7 sleeves used in 14 days. 7x66 credits is 455 credits per fortnight. $4.55US per fortnight.

  If I used your Calloway balls taking into account their extended durability I would use approximately 15 Calloway balls per fortnight. Each sleeve costs 300 credits, so in one fortnight I would need to find 1500 credits $15.00US. Hmm. 

• SeabrookFlash 463 Posts

  Tue, Mar 24 2015 8:38 AM

  I agree with you regarding the additional cost of balls.  I too played with the WGT ball as long as I possibly could before finally deciding to change.  Fortunately for me, I can usually earn enough free credits to keep me from buying balls every week.  Although it is getting harder and harder to do. Good luck with your game and congratulations for your move up to Legend.