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Balancing the scales.

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Thu, Sep 6 2012 3:59 AM (12 replies)
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  • Timbo1984
    818 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 4:55 AM

    I've frequented this site for some time now, and when I initially came across it I was perplexed by the complex and accurate nature of the game and how it was made and played.

    This above statement is still ringing true in my thoughts when I reflect on the work needed to be done in order to make a game like this. I mention this so as not to come across as being slightly hypocritical in my comments to follow. Also I would like to mention that the players on here are one of the reasons which make this game enjoyable as well as financially viable to make, hence the title. Players to aspire to get as good as, which could be named from anyone of the many country clubs including my own, and indeed those not affiliated to one but harness skill just as great. Also the players on par with my own skill level and even those lesser to it, which bring personalities together to play a game we all have fun spending time on.

    However of late I feel my own excitement levels towards this game dwindling somewhat. As I mentioned above when I joined I thought this game was great, and it still is. But it is not greater.

    I say this with the idea that there is a balance between this game of product (i.e. courses and equipment) and affordability (the word speaks for itself).

    I have read but not corroborated that WGT promised to create 2 golf courses each year. As it stands that will not happen this year (not sure if they intended Trugolf courses to be apart of that equation), as record shows it is basically the US and British Opens that are the courses they focus on. They missed the latter and as such I expect no other WGT made course this year. The excuse could be made that Trugolf courses are introduced, but to be fair WGT...You did not spend any time/money making them. I say money, as we need to pay a fee in order to play games on these courses which no doubt would be the terms of use from Trugolf. Essentially meaning we shoulder the cost for the course to be here.

    I also am aware of the amends WGT tried to make for the lack of the British Open course not being created. They hosted a number of tournaments with extremely lavish prizes to make up for this. Great for the winner...What about the rest of us? Given a choice...99.9% of us would have chosen a new course over a fancy holiday, as only one person can win that. A new course means all of us win. Also why was the Open course not followed through, I'm sure none of us would have minded too much if you went through with the creation of it after the conclusion of the Open. Any new WGT course is a good course, regardless of when it is released. 

    As far as equipment is concerned (balls not included here, yet), bar a limited few, there are only two main real life brands on offer club-wise, Ping and Taylormade. Which has been the case since I joined. No real push has been made to get other names on board, although I understand that some brands might not be interested and that could explain same. However, there has been equipment that has been brought out bearing the above named brands which have eventually been flung from the shelves, replaced by that same manufacturers newer equipment which gives almost the same benefit to the buyer as the previous equipment, but costs almost 3 times as much. A good example of this would be the Satin Wedges and G-10 range. My personal opinion here is that the equipment was too good for the price that it was being sold at in relation to the current price increase of newer equipment currently being introduced. However I know that no one affiliated with WGT would ever confirm this statement or even reply to it, so it is probably best left in the realm of personal opinion.

    On that note, the affordability of the site has become something that might be considered in certain lines of thought as...Shocking. 

    Where once we could get equipment at a price which was reasonable for most, and even for those with a humble budget to spend could decide that the cost was worth the product. But in recent times the cost has exceeded the product...Once again, these are my personal thoughts, some may feel different to the words I am putting down here. I will not go into the certain products and what they cost, we all know the price of the items in the Pro Shop. But the new MAX Meter balls and the price tag hanging on them could be a prime example of what to expect as far as any new equipment and what the increase in price will be from update to update. It is fair to assume that in the not too distant future we will have balls that will cost $10 a sleeve. This is not a random comment, it is a logical prediction to the increase in relation to products that is a trend WGT seem to be setting.

    The other disappointment I have had is that the new products of late, are not branded ones. Rather WGT-made products. So there is no royalties or payments due to an external name. However the cost has become what I would consider unreasonable. The effort involved in creating a ball is as simple as taking a stater ball and clicking a few buttons to make it behave a certain way, much like you would adjust the volume control setting on your PC. No cost went into "inventing" this new ball. But the price...How can this be justified? 

    The feeling I get is that WGT is trying to make money off this game now more than before and in any way they can make it. This is my personal feelings, which I have a right to have, and no person can accuse another of feeling a certain way.

    The product releases of late have been novelties...Nothing more. The price tags on them have been unreasonable...Nothing less. For instance the speed up boost being sold in different speeds...It is like selling someone a DVD player but telling them if they want a fast forward button it'll cost 10 bucks extra, and a further 10 bucks for each speed thereafter...Would you not leave the shop if posed with that kind of deal? For me this is product out weighs any ball or club at any price as...for lack of a better term...Money grabbing. You should NEVER have to pay for something of that nature.

    I feel if you could grade the performance of a game developing company and decide thereafter upon that grading what the pricing of their products should be, WGT would find they have over shot the mark by about 40% above prime. 

    I have no intention of leaving this game nor am I frustrated or annoyed in anyway, I enjoy this game immensely, and the people I have met and continue to meet go a long way in making me want to spend time on this site. I have also constructed this post in a way that highlights the irritations I am feeling and have for the purposes of writing about one idea and not many, have left out the good work done by WGT on purpose. I will and have been in the past, the first to say a job well done where it has been deserved of applause.

    All that is written above is basically concerns I felt like highlighting as I know that this site's moderators and even management read the forums, and take into consideration thoughts placed here...And my main thought is that your products pricing has gone passed the threshold of justification. 

    If a 2nd course was made this year and the expense proved to be quite profound and the one way to cover these costs is an increase in product pricing, I don't think I would be expressing my thoughts in this post they way I have done...But if you look at it from that point of view and now that we are one course less than promised with prices sky-rocketing, essentially we are paying more...For less. 

     

     

     

  • gofbals
    178 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 7:15 AM

    well said and i agree 

  • Royboy1946
    1,847 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 7:39 AM

    Timbo1984:

    I've frequented this site for some time now, and when I initially came across it I was perplexed by the complex and accurate nature of the game and how it was made and played.

    I have no intention of leaving this game nor am I frustrated or annoyed in anyway, I enjoy this game immensely, and the people I have met and continue to meet go a long way in making me want to spend time on this site. I have also constructed this post in a way that highlights the irritations I am feeling and have for the purposes of writing about one idea and not many, have left out the good work done by WGT on purpose. I will and have been in the past, the first to say a job well done where it has been deserved of applause.

    All that is written above is basically concerns I felt like highlighting as I know that this site's moderators and even management read the forums, and take into consideration thoughts placed here...And my main thought is that your products pricing has gone passed the threshold of justification. 

    If a 2nd course was made this year and the expense proved to be quite profound and the one way to cover these costs is an increase in product pricing, I don't think I would be expressing my thoughts in this post they way I have done...But if you look at it from that point of view and now that we are one course less than promised with prices sky-rocketing, essentially we are paying more...For less. 

    Such a great piece, my friend. I only wish it was four fold more. Such though and touch.

    An educated person to say the least. I am sending you a friend invite, please accept, i feel you would be a great addition to any game we play on WGT.

    BTW wholeheartedly agree with your opinions.

  • BubbaCrusher007
    1,567 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 8:36 AM

    I'm no mental giant obviously.

    But if you don't like a product, maybe, don't buy it?

    Just sayin

  • Timbo1984
    818 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 8:47 AM

    BubbaCrusher007:

    I'm no mental giant obviously.

    But if you don't like a product, maybe, don't buy it?

    Just sayin

    A very good point!

    I thought of writing that...If it does not suit your pocket, then just don't flick a coin at it.

    But you could argue that if good cheap equipment is being thrown out I.E. the Satin wedges and G10 clubs...Would it not be reasonable to entertain the thought that perhaps one day the level 71 Nikes would out live their usefulness and be replaced with pricier ones doing almost the same thing. The same could in principle apply to any other product you might buy, or have bought that is currently in the Pro Shop.

    It's been done before...

     

  • CerinoDevoti
    3,232 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 10:09 AM

    Timbo1984:

    BubbaCrusher007:

    I'm no mental giant obviously.

    But if you don't like a product, maybe, don't buy it?

    Just sayin

    A very good point!

    I thought of writing that...If it does not suit your pocket, then just don't flick a coin at it.

    But you could argue that if good cheap equipment is being thrown out I.E. the Satin wedges and G10 clubs...Would it not be reasonable to entertain the thought that perhaps one day the level 71 Nikes would out live their usefulness and be replaced with pricier ones doing almost the same thing. The same could in principle apply to any other product you might buy, or have bought that is currently in the Pro Shop.

    It's been done before...

     

    It's a simple mirror of our disposable society. Every year the new greatest thing comes out to replace last years greatest thing.. They don't continue selling brand new 3 year old products most anywhere. The new stuff is sold and the old is forgotten. The golf product industry is full of this kind of thinking.

     

    BTW, I'm in the  sales/marketing industry so "new product sales" are what I do evey day. New sales are what drive profits and make the investors happy. Customers hanging on to their older products don't pay the current bills. WGT is in this same situation. All normal IMO.

  • TWOMINUSONE
    2,580 Posts
    Tue, Sep 4 2012 10:43 AM

    The effort involved in creating a ball is as simple as taking a stater ball and clicking a few buttons to make it behave a certain way, much like you would adjust the volume control setting on your PC. No cost went into "inventing" this new ball.

     

    Just on that thought. I sometimes marvel when i see my opponents putt rolling towards the hole, that was unfortunate enough to land a great distance from the hole. I marvel at the the way the ball follows every contour of the green, rolling at great speed. Then as it approaches the hole, and the speed decreases, you can see the ball actually rolling and breaking around that last little break. Then the ball comes to an absolute crawl, and just pops into the hole. WOW, you think, that was some great putt, and you know the graphic ability of the game to get this looking so good is working perfectly. Then it comes to my putt, and just as i am about to putt my shot, the sodden meter takes a hike. 

    To make that ball, made up of a bunch of pixels, react the way it did for that great putt, it has to be perfect as i said. So why is it WGT cant get a straight line meter bar to run as smooth. And this meter bar is made up of a lot more pixels that that little ball. Surely its harder to get a small bunch of pixels that rotate to react perfectly, than it is to get a straight line moving perfectly? Just a thought.

  • FamousBeef
    271 Posts
    Wed, Sep 5 2012 12:53 AM

    TWOMINUSONE:

    The effort involved in creating a ball is as simple as taking a stater ball and clicking a few buttons to make it behave a certain way, much like you would adjust the volume control setting on your PC. No cost went into "inventing" this new ball.

     

    Just on that thought. I sometimes marvel when i see my opponents putt rolling towards the hole, that was unfortunate enough to land a great distance from the hole. I marvel at the the way the ball follows every contour of the green, rolling at great speed. Then as it approaches the hole, and the speed decreases, you can see the ball actually rolling and breaking around that last little break. Then the ball comes to an absolute crawl, and just pops into the hole. WOW, you think, that was some great putt, and you know the graphic ability of the game to get this looking so good is working perfectly. Then it comes to my putt, and just as i am about to putt my shot, the sodden meter takes a hike. 

    To make that ball, made up of a bunch of pixels, react the way it did for that great putt, it has to be perfect as i said. So why is it WGT cant get a straight line meter bar to run as smooth. And this meter bar is made up of a lot more pixels that that little ball. Surely its harder to get a small bunch of pixels that rotate to react perfectly, than it is to get a straight line moving perfectly? Just a thought.

    What makes you think they "can't"? Is it because they don't?

  • piztaker
    5,743 Posts
    Wed, Sep 5 2012 1:00 AM

    Here we go again. Do you people really think that WGT has any control over Flash Player?

  • TWOMINUSONE
    2,580 Posts
    Wed, Sep 5 2012 2:38 AM

    What makes you think they "can't"? Is it because they don't?

    Exactomondo FB. Seems they wont.

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