Forums

penalty for quitting

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 1:55 PM

  And for the record...  I have a close family member who has ties (both personally and professionally) with one of the better known Country Clubs here in SF.

  He gets to play a premium course (top 100 courses) for free... no dues, no greens fees, no tee times, nothing.  He wants to play, he just walks on.  Joins a group or heads out single.

  And, when he's playing poorly, or something else comes up, he walks off.

  In other words, HE QUITS.  Whether he's joined a group or not.  He quits a game on a course that most of us can't play, unless we're members, touring pros, or guests who have to pay a very hefty price.

  Bottom line... free golf is free.  You can come and go as you please.

  The problem with most folks on this site (and please don't assign this to anyone in particular, as this is an OBSERVATION of the OVERALL "anti-quitting' population) is that you're either hyper-competitive ("How dare they leave when I'm winning?!", or controlling ("You're not gonna leave MY game!") and you want them punished.

  What you don't realize is, just as we have said time and time again, (and my main point from above that no one has addressed...) Is that WGT is not going to punish quitters because it will drive potential paying customers away.

  I am sorry... that is reality.  You don't like it, I understand.  

  You (this is a generic 'you') can whine, cry, scream, kick and throw all the temper-tantrums that you wish to, as is your right, but the fact is that people are going to quit a free computer game when they don't like it, FOR WHATEVER REASON.

  Look at it this way... WGT is free... free to come and free to go.

  Placing unnecessary burdens on the general population will only drive them away.

  Now, like 200 of us have already said... there are avenues that you can take that will almost guarantee that you will not play with a quitter.  There are the off-site groups that will welcome you with open arms.  There is your own friends list.  There is now any number of Country Clubs...

  Just don't try to punish people for not PLAYING THE GAME the way YOU want the game played.  You're livelihood is not dependent upon the game's population, WGT's is.  To drive away business is suicide.

  Bottom line is this... People quit.  Get over it.  Join people who won't quit and you'll be happier with your experience.

  Peace.

• jayjonbeach 689 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 5:05 PM

  Some good points made for sure.

  I can understand that the people who are new that just join random games because they have no friends yet can get frustrated. 

  In addition to the many solutions already offered, really anyone who reads these forums should not have play very many random games.  Anyone who simply posts I need some non-quitting friends will have quite a few responses, I've seen it time and time again. 

  Even out of the random matches you will eventually find non-quitters who you can friend up and play with in future matches.  Friends of one ink or another are the best solution, whether your own, in a CC, on the ladders, GS site or all combined, once you go down this path random matches should not be something you ever need to do. 

  -------------------------

  Let's not also forget as I am not sure it was mentioned, WGT is still going to bring in the reputation feature which really should help the new people the most since they wont have friends to start with.  By seeking out people/matches with those who have a good reputation this will reduce the amount of matches they or anyone will have to play with any quitters at all (until they build up a friend list)

• skeptical 62 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 9:14 PM

  lvietri:

  Let's be serious.

  I agree.

  lvietri:

  First --- to all of you who want WGT to penalize people who quit .... i commend all of you for never leaving a game ... for whatever reason.

  Where did you get that from?

  Wanting wgt to penalize quitters doesn't mean we never leaved a game. 

  lvietri:

   --- this is not real golf ... these are not real golf tournaments ... so please don't relate this to a real golf situation.   This is a game ---the best golf simulator on line but a game none the less.

  Why??!

  Haven't you yet noticed this game is all about relating it to real golf?

  lvietri:

  Finally --- why would WGT want to impose a penalty on people who play their game.

  Because it would improve gameplay.

  lvietri:

  why would they want to upset customer who will spend money on clubs, balls and other items.

  Why would a customer be upset by a gameplay improvement?

  lvietri:

  For those who want to quit .. they should keep playing the open match play games (i.e. not for credits) and for those who don't ... play the ladders, join crazyman's league .. or play for credits if your allowed to .... lots of options ...

  Fact that these external sites are available shouldn't mean that ranked multigames have to be a pain for genuine players.

  lvietri:

  just don't expect WGT to penalize customers --- it's not good for business.

  This has nothing to do with penalizing customers. It's about penalizing players who forfeit ranked games, in order to considerably overcome the quitting issue and, very important, to give a better relation with the real game. These add gameplay. Period.

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 10:06 PM

  ***sorry... double post somehow.  Please disregard this one****

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 10:12 PM

  skeptical:

  lvietri:

   --- this is not real golf ... these are not real golf tournaments ... so please don't relate this to a real golf situation.   This is a game ---the best golf simulator on line but a game none the less.

  Why??!

  Haven't you yet noticed this game is all about relating it to real golf?

  This is not real golf, I am sorry to break it to you, Skeptical.  You can't take these scores to the USGA for a handicap.  This is no more real golf than Grand Theft Auto is real thuggery.  This may be the most realistic SIMULATION of a golf game on the internet, but it's a game.  A game that people play from their homes and work in their spare time.

  You can't regulate how they are to spend their time.  As much as you want to, it's not going to happen.  Again, and you refuse to speak to this point...  WGT will not jeopardize potential customers by PLACING UNNECESSARY BURDENS ON THEM.  Forcing them to do anything is an UNNECESSARY BURDEN.

  skeptical:

  lvietri:

  Finally --- why would WGT want to impose a penalty on people who play their game.

  Because it would improve gameplay.

  No, it wouldn't.  To you, perhaps, but you are in the vocal minority.

  skeptical:

  lvietri:

  why would they want to upset customer who will spend money on clubs, balls and other items.

  Why would a customer be upset by a gameplay improvement?

  Invalid argument.  Penalizing players is NOT gameplay improvement.

  skeptical:

  It's about penalizing players who forfeit ranked games, in order to considerably overcome the quitting issue and, very important, to give a better relation with the real game.

  No, it doesn't... it's about vindictive players trying to punish the others who don't play the game the way they THINK they should.

   

  Nothing else.

  People quit.  Get over it.

• skeptical 62 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 10:13 PM

  Snaike:

  And for the record...  I have a close family member who has ties (both personally and professionally) with one of the better known Country Clubs here in SF.

  He gets to play a premium course (top 100 courses) for free... no dues, no greens fees, no tee times, nothing.  He wants to play, he just walks on.  Joins a group or heads out single.

  And, when he's playing poorly, or something else comes up, he walks off.

  In other words, HE QUITS.  Whether he's joined a group or not.  He quits a game on a course that most of us can't play, unless we're members, touring pros, or guests who have to pay a very hefty price.

  I would intend that as a practice round in wgt. Not ranked.

  Snaike:

  Bottom line... free golf is free.  You can come and go as you please.

  If something is free doesn't mean rules have to be lushy.

  Snaike:

  The problem with most folks on this site (and please don't assign this to anyone in particular, as this is an OBSERVATION of the OVERALL "anti-quitting' population) is that you're either hyper-competitive ("How dare they leave when I'm winning?!", or controlling ("You're not gonna leave MY game!") and you want them punished.

  No, i'm just hyper-rational ("How can they forfeit a ranked game with no penalty?!").

  Snaike:

  What you don't realize is, just as we have said time and time again, (and my main point from above that no one has addressed...)

  What? I addressed your weak lemonade example few replies ago. Read that?

  Snaike:

  Is that WGT is not going to punish quitters because it will drive potential paying customers away.

  I am sorry... that is reality.  You don't like it, I understand.

  Why would a gameplay improvement drive paying customers away?

  Snaike:

  You (this is a generic 'you') can whine, cry, scream, kick and throw all the temper-tantrums that you wish to, as is your right, but the fact is that people are going to quit a free computer game when they don't like it, FOR WHATEVER REASON.

  Why would people dislike a gameplay improvement?

  Snaike:

  Look at it this way... WGT is free... free to come and free to go.

  Again, if something is free doesn't mean rules have to be lushy.

  Snaike:

  Placing unnecessary burdens on the general population will only drive them away.

  Recording a bad score for forfeited rounds is not an unnecessary burden. It's a gameplay improvement.

  Snaike:

  Now, like 200 of us have already said... there are avenues that you can take that will almost guarantee that you will not play with a quitter.  There are the off-site groups

  Fact that off-site groups are available shouldn't mean that wgt ranked multigames have to be a pain for genuine players.

  Snaike:

  There is your own friends list.  There is now any number of Country Clubs...

  I like to play with different players as much as possible. And i think many others do.  'ANYONE' button is a bless.

  Also think about those who purposely don't add friends to gain improvement in smoothness.

  Snaike:

  Just don't try to punish people for not PLAYING THE GAME the way YOU want the game played.

  Why not if it leads to an improvement?

  Snaike:

  Bottom line is this... People quit.  Get over it.  Join people who won't quit and you'll be happier with your experience.

  People should get a bad score when they forfeit a ranked round. Join our thinking and you'll be happier with your experience.

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 10:23 PM

  Again... 

  WGT will not place an unnecessary burden on potential customers.  How do I know this?  History.

  WGT has done nothing about the quitting problem since the first quitter appeared.  They have a 'reputation tracker' in the works to let geeks (geeks = people who play by numbers) know who has finished all of their rounds... problem is that the 'reputation tracker' is flawed and it's very low on their priority list.  It won't stop the quitters, but it will give people like you a reason to not play with others.

  Forcing people to accept a bad score is not a gameplay improvement, so you can really scale back on that argument.

  I would like to see WGT remain free.  If you wish to have a pay-to-play site, please enjoy TWO with my compliments.  I understand they have what... 9, 10... 11 courses there now?

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 10:34 PM

  If I may add...

  I received a message today from someone who happened to be following this exchange...  the message, in part said:

   

  WGT'er:

  Snaike:

  Look at it this way... WGT is free... free to come and free to go.

  Placing unnecessary burdens on the general population will only drive them away."

  WGT would be the only game in town that forces you to play their way instead of letting you play your way.

  "... forces you to play their way instead of letting you play your way."

  Just about says it all.  

   

• skeptical 62 Posts

  Sun, May 30 2010 10:46 PM

  jayjonbeach:

  Even out of the random matches you will eventually find non-quitters who you can friend up and play with in future matches.  Friends of one ink or another are the best solution, whether your own, in a CC, on the ladders, GS site or all combined, once you go down this path random matches should not be something you ever need to do.

  Fact that there are complementary ways to overcome the issue doesn't mean the original way has to be lushy.

  Also, very important, it's not just about the quitting issue at this point, it's also about improving that relationship with the real game riskaddiction correctly brought in few replies ago.

  jayjonbeach:

  Let's not also forget as I am not sure it was mentioned, WGT is still going to bring in the reputation feature

  Sure was mentioned. In this reply

  skeptical:

  i am uncertain it will work good as the solution i have stated. Basically because i think so many players don't care about a reputation indicator as they do about their score

  Then in this other reply

  skeptical:

  Setting score penalty on ranked games i think, would not only work the issue better than reputation system, it would also add that relationship with real golf riskaadiction stated. Reputation system may be worth for practice mode. Not for ranked.

• riskaddiction 23 Posts

  Mon, May 31 2010 1:20 AM

  Snaike:

  No, it doesn't... it's about vindictive players trying to punish the others who don't play the game the way they THINK they should.

  joining ranked multiplayer games is a choice..   

  no one is forcing anyone to do anything..   

  why on earth does this guy think a horrible multiplayer experience will keep customers coming back..    

  everyone who enters the game clearly sees the TERMS before they accept and tee off..

  furthermore they are still free to quit at anytime..   but that action should carry some consequence.        

  quitters effectively ruin the game for the remaining players and greatly reduce the intensity and fun factor for the remaining round. 

  you need to sweat bullets sometimes and make those crucial shots and dig yourself out of a hole.  thats golf.  

  as it stands now you have people leaving at the very moment a real golfer would be tested to show what they are made of.

  by removing the drama and stress that comes with potential failure, wgt is failing to deliver key elements that make for an "authentic" golf experience.