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What is 5 dots precision and 5 dot forgiveness

• Jimbog1964 8,378 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 7:57 AM

  YankeeJim:

  The scrambling and sand save %s say a lot and I'll leave it at that.  ;-)

  Not even those necessarily Jim.  Mine are crapola really - way worse than representative.  Chasing that L93 par 3ing a starter ball whilst looking elsewhere carpet bombed mine.  Probably never going to recover (hopefully lol).  Gotta be careful even there.

  As for dots and stuff I think WGTNIV put it as eloquently as I have seen it in this old thread:)

  That old thread before I stumbled across the game, but see a certain YamkeeJim helping even back then:)

• ApexPC 3,164 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 8:13 AM

  Maybe this will help. Particularly those that think WGT changes club performance.

  WGTniv:

  Forgiveness shifts the precision circle left or right (and usually short) depending on how much you mishit and what the forgiveness rating of the club is.  Clubs with lesser forgiveness ratings shift the circle left/right more on mishits.

  This is why (especially on low precision clubs) you can mishit slightly right of the mark and have the ball go left instead.  Mishitting right shifts the circle to the right, but part of the circle is still "leftover" on the left side of the flag, so it has the potential to land there.

  WGTniv:

  The game is pretty simple.  Precision controls your accuracy.  Imagine it's like a circle that surrounds the flagstick when you aim at it.  The size of that circle is related to the precision rating.  The higher the rating the smaller the circle.  Your ball can land anywhere in the circle on a dinged shot (left or right, long or short).  It will ALWAYS land in the circle on a ding shot, though sometimes it may land in the center of the circle and sometimes it may land on the very outer edge or anywhere in between those two points.  When it lands on the outer edge this is what you guys have come to know as "the beast".  Was the shot pre-programmed? Does it know you're standing on the 17th hole at Kiawah?  No, it's just unfortunate timing.  The result you see is the logical spread dictated by the precision rating of the club over 100 or 1,000 or 10,000 shots taken on the site.  No matter how big or small the sample it'samazingly consistent because it is after all only a simple mathematical formula.  The shot data is spread out amongst all users, so there will be times when you run into a lot of "edge cases" (aka deviations, aka outside edge of the precision circle) and times where you seemingly can't miss the center (even when you mishit).  This is the ebb and flow of the game and it's always been there.  In the short term you will have "bad" days and "good" days.  In the long term (providing they are using the same clubs) any one player will see the same amount of "edge cases" or "deviations" that the rest of the players do.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 8:17 AM

  Jimbog1964:

  Not even those necessarily Jim.  Mine are crapola really - way worse than representative.

  Same here, Jim, and I've got 3 more years of hacking away in them. However, they speak volumes when you consider them when reading about things like clubs changing mid-stream, etc.  ;-)

• drmoose 3,540 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 8:39 AM

  YankeeJim:

  they speak volumes when you consider them when reading about things like clubs changing mid-stream, etc.  ;-)

  Just to be clear, sand save and scramble percentages dictate how much creedence should be given to any statements that pertain to clubs performing (or the game performing) differently than when  items were purchased? Let me rephrase my statement. WGT introduced equipment that touted top performance, people shot low scores, game parameters were changed to prevent those low scores. Now ,either the clubs performances were changed or the game was made more difficult to play. It's semantics, either way the end result is the same.

  Doc :)

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 10:31 AM

  drmoose:

  . Now ,either the clubs performances were changed or the game was made more difficult to play. It's semantics, either way the end result is the same.

  Semantics? I think not simply because, IRL, clubs don't change but conditions do. Courses get harder or easier depending on how you look at it. The constant is the equipment and it is here, too. To think WGT is being deceptive when they say they don't change club attributes contradicts this RL fact. Claiming updates modify clubs does the same thing. 

• andyson 6,415 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 10:49 AM

  renniw52:

  Wind is 15 mph from 9-3. You adjust for that wind, ding your shot with all of your mega dot equipment, you should get a decent result. I play BPB a lot. I just like the course. Let's use nbr. 2 for an example. I have a 12 mph tail wind, slightly blowing right. I use full bs, ding the shot, drive is 298 perfectly placed in the fairway. I can play this hole again, new round, almost identical situation,aim same spot, same full bs, ding the shot and wham right into the tree on the left, drops in 70% rough. This should not happen. If I have taken the time to play this over and over, know the proper way to miss that tree, how in the hell does it just all of sudden change?

  Renni, I don't know if you ever read the post I made on the R1 Driver Precision but I found quite a bit of left/right normal variance on dinged shots.  Here's a picture of the results of 9 dinged shots with no wind condition:

  

  Shots hit the same way seldom repeat.  Its built into the game.

• drmoose 3,540 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 1:18 PM

  YJ,

  The point I am trying to make here,is that by changing the degree of difficulty, with which the game plays, they (WGT) inherently change the way the equipment performs within the game.

  If club "A" hits ball "B" with a certain amount of force "C" @ ding "D" times degree of difficulty "E" you achieve a result somewhere within a prescribed range of results. If you increase the degree of difficulty, you increase the prescribed range of results. Different results = equipment operating differently. To me, this is a logical conclusion, but hey, I'm proud of my tinfoil hat, so what do I know ?

  Doc :)

• renniw52 5,385 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 1:34 PM

  Basically what I was saying Andy. It is programmed, you practice it, figure it out, why in the hell does it change? And how in the hell do some people know it has changed? Only explanation for some of the scores we see. I have hit enough balls now to know how to play the holes I play. When it changes from round to round, it is total nonsense. I never expect to be one of the Elite players on here, that is not my goal. I only expect a shot to react within reason, the same each time you play. If I hit my R1 with a 15 mph tail wind, ding the shot, I expect 300 plus, not 365 one time and 298 the next time. If i have a 3 foot putt with no elevation i hit it 4 plus feet, one time it goes in the next time it stops short. This is getting away from the reality the game is supposed to give us. I understand the differences in the fairways, you hit an uphill lie or downhill, I am saying with that wind my ball will usually never touch the ground less than 300 feet. Has nothing to do with the roll out. Again, I don't give a flying you know what, playing for fun only. Just asking questions and listening to the answers. The employees at WGT are just doing what they are told, doing their job. Sometimes I feel they are doing a job on us, the ones who gave them a job in the first place.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 2:07 PM

  drmoose:

  The point I am trying to make here,is that by changing the degree of difficulty, with which the game plays, they (WGT) inherently change the way the equipment performs within the game.

  Pardon me if I find that a bit ludicrous. It's like saying my RL R1 went 300 today on a solid hit but yesterday it only went 280 because there was a wind. The day before it went 320 but that was because the fairway was dry and it rolled. That wind brought rain and slowed down the drive the next day because the fairways were wet. The fairways dried out a little the next day so the drive went 300.

  Do I write to TaylorMade and tell them to quit messing with my driver?

• renniw52 5,385 Posts

  Mon, Jan 27 2014 4:35 PM

  No winning or losing on this thread. Opinions are like, well you know. May as well throw in the towel and try again down the road.