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Monthly & Weekly Tournament Payout Totals Are Changing

• kavvz 2,195 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 7:56 AM

  el3n1:

  fmagnets:

  I'd also suggest keeping a running total of winnings including every form of the game for every player, just like the score history is kept. Once the player surpasses a certain earnings threshold, it's automatic tier up.

  That said, once I did start playing ready go's I found even playing reasonably well, the profit margin is rather slim and you can "increase your career earnings" while losing credits.  The bigger the entry the more you can lose and still show "earnings" while losing credits.  

  I kept track for a month of credits in vs out, and at the end of the month netted negative credits.  Think earnings was about $75, but still at the end of the day that wasn't a positive bank roll.  

  With that said it really doesn't factor in IMO.  I still did well enough to earn $75, but the fact that my ball purchases counteracted that surplus is kind of irrelevant to what fmags is trying to say I think.  i.e.  Still managed to place pretty well in some RG's to earn and if I was a Master doing that I should be moved up regardless of what the bottom line netted out to be.

  el3n1:

  Players should not be able to in essence buy their promotion into Tour Champion or Champion by playing in a small club with a generous owner. 

  Don't really know how owners with deep pockets could factor in here.  That's a tough one.

  el3n1:

  I would also suggest the Tour Champion tier, if opened, remain "invitation only" to prevent the issue that has arisen in the champion tier by allowing so many to exploit easy red tee tournaments to get promoted, imho anyway.  

  If I may ask why?  If someone wants to get to higher tiers via red tee tourney's I don't know why that bothers anyone.  They're only making it harder for themselves sooner.  

• WGTChampion 1,891 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 8:32 AM

  birchi:

  The 1k RG's usually fill up rather slowly, especially if it's played on an unpopular course like Pinehurst. Is it possible to reduce the number of participants to 30 with payouts to, say, the top 15 for some tournaments? They usually take a while to get to 20-25 participants, but from there it jumps to 50 pretty quickly because people see it's filling up.

  When we set up RGs we put in the number of participants and system knows how to pay it out based on entry fees. I'm not entirely sure the number of participants is changed that it knows what to do. I'll have to find out. 

  fmagnets:

  No need to change the set up - you could just remove the 200 player limit for the weekly multiround. It's a very successful tournament that is over-subscribed. More entrants = more profit for WGT whilst more players are able to play. Everyone's happy.

  This is definitely a popular tournament which is great. So I'm not sure that I should meddle with it too much. Maybe I'll make a second one to see if you all like it. Unfortunately that would mean that 

  fmagnets:

  Top 10 payout would be an interesting experiment. More chance of hitting a prize, but also more attainable scores once you look past the best 3 or 4.

  I was thinking if we could do the math on it maybe we could do the same total payouts for the top 3 plus a top 70. Might be an interesting change, I just don't think it would be explained properly in the way the info page works on tournaments. I'm actually not sure that we can use both specific placement payouts and top 70 together. 

  fmagnets:

  I'd also suggest keeping a running total of winnings including every form of the game for every player, just like the score history is kept. Once the player surpasses a certain earnings threshold, it's automatic tier up.

  This is a good idea. It wouldn't stop all of the problems with restart players but any amount would be helpful. 

  LuckySkreet:

  Several good ideas......             But, Champ....    what about that "Tour Champion Tier"  thing?   I could really use those 300 creds.....

  I promise I'm trying to get this done.

  _CHAMPION

• twinponds169 3,044 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 9:20 AM

  I know we all appreciate the efforts here to consider player input and for keeping us in the loop more. Great job on improving these aspects.

  Can you make Level 201 attainable? Either that or perhaps a new tier, maybe Institutionalized Champion?

  :-)

• WGTChampion 1,891 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 9:28 AM

  The new tiers will go Champion, then Tour Champion, then Institutionalized Champion, then Sarah Connor at the beginning of Terminator 2. :-P

  _CHAMPION 

• Young46 1,298 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 9:42 AM

  Any chance to make the Virtual Tour a year-long competition as opposed to quarterly? Of course as others have stated it would also be nice to have at 2 single play rounds for regular events and 3 for the majors.

  If you are looking to increase participation in ready-go's why not offer more 100cr/200cr/300cr options. To my knowledge there aren't any 200cr ready-go's for Champions. Also, I remember a few years back they did a 2,000cr St. Andrews RG for a bit and it filled up fairly quick.

• fmagnets 3,640 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 10:04 AM

  el3n1:

  So, while I agree there is merit to using one's career earnings, I also agree how those earnings are acquired should play a factor as well.

  Forget about the idea of 'career earnings' the way WGT lists it now. This is a red herring. I'm talking about net profit (winnings minus entry fees, even minus ball usage if WGT want to go that deep) for every type of event/match played. If you leave any loopholes or types of events that aren't counted, these are what the cheats will exploit to make, sell, and move their credits.

  If you happen to be a rare case of finding yourself in a CC with a generous owner where you can win credits with mediocre scores and get tiered up faster than you should because of it, so be it. Players ending up in too high a tier for their ability is only a problem for them (and is already commonplace). It's players that stick around deliberately in too a low a tier that's the problem for every genuine player in that tier.

• WGTChampion 1,891 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 10:38 AM

  Young46:

  Any chance to make the Virtual Tour a year-long competition as opposed to quarterly? Of course as others have stated it would also be nice to have at 2 single play rounds for regular events and 3 for the majors.

  If you are looking to increase participation in ready-go's why not offer more 100cr/200cr/300cr options. To my knowledge there aren't any 200cr ready-go's for Champions. Also, I remember a few years back they did a 2,000cr St. Andrews RG for a bit and it filled up fairly quick.

  Not sure about VT. I know there are certain rules to them. 

  Problem with TL and Champ RGs is that they don't fill, sometimes for over a month. I did set up some new ones (one for each tier) for the next round (I think Nov 10 is the start date). Also, I made them pretty hard, not that ever stops you all from shooting 55s. 

  fmagnets:

  Forget about the idea of 'career earnings' the way WGT lists it now. This is a red herring. I'm talking about net profit (winnings minus entry fees, even minus ball usage if WGT want to go that deep) for every type of event/match played. If you leave any loopholes or types of events that aren't counted, these are what the cheats will exploit to make, sell, and move their credits.

  If you happen to be a rare case of finding yourself in a CC with a generous owner where you can win credits with mediocre scores and get tiered up faster than you should because of it, so be it. Players ending up in too high a tier for their ability is only a problem for them (and is already commonplace). It's players that stick around deliberately in too a low a tier that's the problem for every genuine player in that tier.

  This is a common problem here. We have ideas that would be great, but once you dig into how players can receive career earnings it makes for something that could be exploited. We've had the same career earnings since the game launched (I think). To split those into two different kinds of career earnings could be extremely confusing, or to change the rules would make a number of players upset. 

  This is one of the things we do a lot of around here is try to find how someone will break or exploit something before players have a chance to. This was the main reason the CC bank never happened. 

  _CHAMPION 

• birchi 1,492 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 10:59 AM

  WGTChampion:

  Young46:

  Any chance to make the Virtual Tour a year-long competition as opposed to quarterly? Of course as others have stated it would also be nice to have at 2 single play rounds for regular events and 3 for the majors.

  If you are looking to increase participation in ready-go's why not offer more 100cr/200cr/300cr options. To my knowledge there aren't any 200cr ready-go's for Champions. Also, I remember a few years back they did a 2,000cr St. Andrews RG for a bit and it filled up fairly quick.

  Not sure about VT. I know there are certain rules to them. 

  Problem with TL and Champ RGs is that they don't fill, sometimes for over a month. I did set up some new ones (one for each tier) for the next round (I think Nov 10 is the start date). Also, I made them pretty hard, not that ever stops you all from shooting 55s. 

  I think he didn't talk about Champion-tier-specific tournaments here, just that there are no 200cr tournaments Champions can play in (in contrast to the 200cr RGs that exist for Legend tier and down). Some 200cr, 300cr tournaments that are open for all tiers would fill up extremely quickly. Even the 300cr heavy wind tourney is filling up daily right now. 

• EasyEdward 13,507 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 11:02 AM

  WGTChampion:

  This is one of the things we do a lot of around here is try to find how someone will break or exploit something before players have a chance to. This was the main reason the CC bank never happened. 

  This is the first (and therefore only) time WGT has mentioned the CC Bank since Icon promised us it was on the way four and a half years ago.

  May I ask exactly how WGT thought it might be exploited? Basically for our CC at the time it was simply going to be used to pool resources to help members where obtaining free credits was virtually impossible.

• WGTChampion 1,891 Posts

  Thu, Oct 25 2018 11:20 AM

  EasyEdward:

  WGTChampion:

  This is one of the things we do a lot of around here is try to find how someone will break or exploit something before players have a chance to. This was the main reason the CC bank never happened. 

  This is the first (and therefore only) time WGT has mentioned the CC Bank since Icon promised us it was on the way four and a half years ago.

  May I ask exactly how WGT thought it might be exploited? Basically for our CC at the time it was simply going to be used to pool resources to help members where obtaining free credits was virtually impossible.

  Pretty easy, the CC bank would allow players to pool their credits and the owner (and other players with permission) to use the bank to fund tournaments. 

  Essentially it could allow players to move credits around in ways that break our T&C, like using a bunch of multis to pool credits and have a tournament that only the main account plays in. It could also allow a player with permission to set up a single tournament and be the only one who plays in it and then leave the club with everyone's credits. 

  I'm sure many of you have seen clubs that are filled with suspect players, and I'm sure that many of you have had some issue with a club member goes rogue. The CC bank would work in a world where everyone was respectful and using it properly but we all know that's not how it works.

  _CHAMPION