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Players disconnecting

Sun, Nov 29 2009 1:30 PM (49 replies)
  • Faterson
    2,902 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 8:56 AM

    YankeeJim:
    Some innocents will suffer with the guilty. It's better than what's in place now.

    There's no need for innocents to suffer. WGT just need to make sure the feature is implemented correctly. And because there are many intricacies to this, it's best not to implement the feature retroactively.

  • WGTadmin2
    1,152 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 9:12 AM

    This is a very good discussion and helpful, but let's keep it positive.

    The general theory is that players can do whatever they want in single player games, however if you start a multiplayer game you need to finish it.  Obviously there are a lot of situations and edge cases but this is the concept.

  • Faterson
    2,902 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 9:18 AM

    Yes, that concept is correct. Two important implementation principles would be:

    • Don't penalize the last player who is left alone on the course by everyone else. He/She should be allowed to quit with no penalty.
    • Don't penalize anyone if all players disconnect within (say) 60 seconds. (This is to enable those sudden-death shootouts.) 
  • WGTadmin2
    1,152 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 9:36 AM

    We will look into these, but the second case is not really consistent with the first.  If I go through the reasoning your second case combined with your first case will mean that in 2 person matches (that are not sudden death) if one person disconnected (on purposes to be a jerk) and the second player is frustrated and leaves within 60 sec, both players will not get flagged for a disconnect.?  Also please clarify for us what a sudden death shoot out is since I am assuming this is something to support a 3rd party site.

  • Faterson
    2,902 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 9:47 AM

    WGTadmin2:
    We will look into these, but the second case is not really consistent with the first.

    I thought of that. If a player is left alone on the course by everyone else, he/she would need to wait 60 seconds before disconnecting. The 60-second wait would confirm that the players who had left before did quit their rounds prematurely. (The same would of course also be confirmed by the other players finishing the round.) It's very simple, and waiting for 61 seconds will not put a strain on anyone. A timer counting down the seconds might pop up on the screen for the remaining player left alone on the course. It might say, "Please wait for 60 (59, 58, 57...) seconds to confirm you were left alone on the course in a multi-player game, or continue your round immediately." After the 60 seconds are over, another message might pop up, saying, "You are now free to quit this round without any penalty. You can also continue your round."

    WGTadmin2:
    Also please clarify for us what a sudden death shoot out is

    There are certain community-organized tournaments that are played in stroke-play mode, but each match needs to have a winner. So if both players, for example, score rounds of 34, they may launch another set of 9 holes to serve as sudden death. Player A may defeat player B on the second hole, and both players would need to disconnect. Please give them that window of 60 seconds, so that if both players disconnect within that time-frame, no one is penalized.

  • AlaCowboy
    1,321 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 9:53 AM

    WGTadmin2:

    This is a very good discussion and helpful, but let's keep it positive.

    The general theory is that players can do whatever they want in single player games, however if you start a multiplayer game you need to finish it.  Obviously there are a lot of situations and edge cases but this is the concept.

    Maybe a small deposit of 2 credits per person in multi-player rounds refunded to each after completion of the round. Anyone that drops out would forfeit their deposit to be split among the finishers and WGT.

    For instance, 4 players enter and deposit 8 credits each (2 credits each for total # of players entered). At the end all complete the round and get their credits back. No losses. But if one drops out the other 3 each get 2 credits from the deposit and WGT takes a 2 credit handling fee If 2 drop out split 3,3, and 2. How to handle the system interruptions and internet glitches I will leave up to more knowledgeable people than myself.

    Just a thought.

  • Doublemochaman
    2,009 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 10:27 AM

    AlaCowboy... this is just my 2 credits worth, but I don't think anyone will waver on sticking out a round over 2 cents.  If there's to be any monetary (credit) penalties I think they need to be more sizable.  I'm more in line for quitters having to wear a big "Q" around their avatar's neck.  Seriously, I think just having a bad round completion percentage will do the trick.

  • YankeeJim
    25,827 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 3:54 PM

    Faterson:
    Don't penalize the last player who is left alone on the course by everyone else. He/She should be allowed to quit with no penalty.

    Just how would this be fair to the one that gets disconnected by (say) an ISP problem? There's no way to rejoin the match and it wouldn't be the person's fault. 

    If you want to add some type of penalty to quitters then to keep the "innocents" from getting harmed you would have to put in place a way to get back to a stroke match after a disconnect, just like it is in match play.

     

    YJ

    p.s.-rather nice having someone from WGT chirping up on the weekends-ty.

     

  • Faterson
    2,902 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 7:57 PM

    YankeeJim:
    Just how would this be fair to the one that gets disconnected by (say) an ISP problem?

    That is why I proposed the 60-second window. If the opponent disconnected within that 60-second time-frame, too, no one would be penalized. I think the opponent almost always has a good idea about whether someone gets disconnected due to Internet problems or not. The ratio is perhaps 1:100 ("Internet problems" versus "I hit a bad shot and wanna quit").

    YankeeJim:
    you would have to put in place a way to get back to a stroke match after a disconnect, just like it is in match play.

    Yeah, it would be ideal if WGT enabled that. However, even if they didn't, they should go ahead and establish the reputation tracker, if the 2 items highlighted above are respected.

    PS: Another idea... Please also make more detailed reputation tracking stats available in each user's account, only to be seen privately by the player. Just so players have a way of checking whether the reputation tracking is working correctly and so they can submit bug reports to WGT if it didn't. In that private area, all the player's disconnected matches would be listed (match date and time of disconnection). Ordinary page visitors would only see the player's completion rate, not those details about individual matches.

  • YankeeJim
    25,827 Posts
    Thu, Nov 26 2009 8:13 PM

    Faterson:
    If the opponent disconnected within that 60-second time-frame, too, no one would be penalized.

    Huh?  You get disconnected for whatever reason and I have 60 seconds to do the same? Or what?

     

    Faterson:
    However, even if they didn't, they should go ahead and establish the reputation tracker, if the 2 items highlighted above are respected.

    ...and I guarantee as sure as your 1:100 wild guess that there will be innocent victims. Seems like we've come full circle on that point.

    We're making this too complicated and a bit burdensome to WGT. Keep it simple and just record the disconnects. The true offenders will show and I doubt most players will condemn an opponent to the point of refusing to play if they have a disconnect or 2 on their record.

     

    YJ

     

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