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Coaching

Mon, Jun 7 2021 9:56 AM (73 replies)
  • el3n1
    4,502 Posts
    Mon, May 31 2021 5:20 PM

    SimonTheBeetle:
    Why don't we just let the player in question play the way he wants, getting all the tips & advice from a better player AND invite him over to a live event where he'll have no choice but play it by himself?

    I think in part because match fixing is against the rules - where 2 or more players seek to disadvantage another player...

    and... even last place earns a cash prize... while the disadvantage players - wins nothing for qualifying for a bracket or advancing the bracket... ONLY the finals offer prizes.

    so - even if we find it humorous, he and the other players who gain an edge by helping that player along - also become bigger favorites  because they potentially knocked out tougher competition.

    I have no idea how WGT could take such a limited view - and suggested the word "coaching" was not against the rules - but neither was it in the rules that it was allowed.

    However - you did see rules against unsportsmanlike behavior, match fixing, collusion between 2 or more players... etc.. WGT just chose to ignore every other rule that applied and appears to have given the players a pass.  Looks really bad and this is now the second time I have seen direct evidence of a blatantly unfair and unjust situation in a major tournament.  

    Very disappointing - and at the highest level of competition - where you would think people would know better - because it has been a hot topic before, at least coaching that is and I believe WGT members agreed it was not good sportsmanship.  

    How people have twisted things around to justify such unsportsmanlike conduct is beyond me.  If that is what it takes to make it thru an etour bracket - i will pass.  

  • kelsp
    2,227 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 12:45 AM
    Well said @el3n1
  • DodgyPutter
    4,690 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 1:17 AM

    SimonTheBeetle:
    Why don't we just let the player in question play the way he wants, getting all the tips & advice from a better player AND invite him over to a live event where he'll have no choice but play it by himself? It would be interesting to watch, I bet. LOL

    It's not complete novices they're coaching, they will end up with £1,000 but probably not embarrassed.

    Ed mentioned something that seems a good idea, why doesn't Champ play the course then try it again with Simon, Ed, yourself.......telling him what to hit where and how then he can see what difference it makes in numbers. 

  • POPPYPEUX
    839 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 1:48 AM

    Easy answer.......add shot timer to all tournaments.......make it 30 seconds so all play is by experience & instinct!!!

    It would also make it more interesting as maybe different players would qualify.....

    ;)

     

  • SimonTheBeetle
    3,647 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 3:40 AM

    pdb1:
    But will they ? Will they let us know what they decide ? Will we disagree more on a new decision ?

    I honestly don't know, Paul. Maybe, maybe not.

    @el3n1 and DodgyPutter

    Again... I agree it's time for WGT to establish a clear rule on this kind of abuse or exploitation of a loophole in the rules. The only thing I wanted to add was maybe a public humiliation might help stop this type of shicers. My concern is though... if the guy's life is that low to do this sort of cheap stuff for a mere cash prize and be unashamed of it, he will probably keep coming back again and again no matter what we do.

    How about no cash prize until you play on a live event at an official venue organized by WGT? Will he still play cheap & dirty even if there's nothing for him to win?

  • Mythanatos
    2,216 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 6:43 AM

    Kind of silly to think that is cheating. Here is why.

    What if instead of being voice to voice right then. The person shared their hole by hole notes with this other person or maybe they posted them in their CC forum some time prior.

    In real golf players have a caddy on the course to give them advice that they can take or not. 

    are all those that use spreadsheets made by someone else cheating?

    The punch charts that have been circulated around?

    Everyone here has probably learned a different way to play a particular hole that they were struggling with from someone else. 

    it seems like people are searching for a reason to get upset again.

  • birchi
    1,492 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 7:24 AM

    Mythanatos:

    Kind of silly to think that is cheating. Here is why.

    What if instead of being voice to voice right then. The person shared their hole by hole notes with this other person or maybe they posted them in their CC forum some time prior.

    In real golf players have a caddy on the course to give them advice that they can take or not. 

    are all those that use spreadsheets made by someone else cheating?

    The punch charts that have been circulated around?

    Everyone here has probably learned a different way to play a particular hole that they were struggling with from someone else. 

    it seems like people are searching for a reason to get upset again.

    "Let me explain why scenario X is not cheating by completely ignoring it and talk about the different scenarios Y and Z instead" 

  • Mythanatos
    2,216 Posts
    Tue, Jun 1 2021 8:26 AM

    birchi:
    "Let me explain why scenario X is not cheating by completely ignoring it and talk about the different scenarios Y and Z instead" 

    If you can't see it's the same info being shared in a different form then There is really no point in you participating in any discussion on a forum. It's basic reasoning. I can show it to my 10 year old nephew and they will understand it.

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