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Does the hole get smaller?

• pmm711 5,709 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:07 AM

  HamdenPro:

  tnivka:

  Is it ok if we focus on the original question?

  The size of the hole is dependent upon the speed of the ball...

  https://www.wgt.com/forums/p/225788/1625725.aspx#1625725

  Just curious, did you try to find your answer by using the search box before creating this thread? (no disrespect intended).

  Just note…the size of the hole stays the same, but, the affect of the speed of the ball decreases the likelihood of the putt dropping…unless hit dead center and then some will hit the back of the cup, pop up, and then drop in.  This works pretty much the same as RL golf...

  PSM Putt Speed Matters

  As for wind speed, wind direction and stuff…it’s definitely all random.  I’ve played other TCs, and winds have ranged from 1-2mph up to the nutty 45mph ones.  This goes for me vs. all lower tiers too.  And I don’t think level matters at all.  It’s all in the luck of the draw as to the match conditions.  The multiplayer match or room entered doesn’t matter…it’s the random course conditions set by the game at the origination of the match.  I just play what the game throws at me without overthinking it.

• MioKontic 4,654 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:16 AM

  AnaNikolaj:

  But we do get different conditions in WGT tiered weeklies and monthlies. The usual setting for TCs in those is high wind and 14,5 greens. 

  I didn't know that.  Thought the highest green speed (not counting the silly ones of 20 and up) was 14.  Back in the day, before green speeds had numbers, Tournament green speed (for Legends as opposed to Tournament for Tour Masters which was slightly slower) was the highest green speed for normal weekly and monthly competitions.  Even the Virtual Open and Virtual US Open qualifying rounds were on Tournament greens.  Championship greens were reserved for the final 4 rounds of the VO and VUSO.

  I don't know what the green speed would be for the final rounds of the VUSO now as I don't play it, but if it is the same as TC's are playing day in day out it's rather unfair on all other tiers who aren't able to do that.

• SimonTheBeetle 3,645 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:27 AM

  pmm711:

  Just note…the size of the hole stays the same, but, the affect of the speed of the ball decreases the likelihood of the putt dropping…unless hit dead center and then some will hit the back of the cup, pop up, and then drop in.  This works pretty much the same as RL golf...

  Different expressions, but essentially, we all talk about the same thing.

  I would express it as "It's all about power, how hard you hit the ball."

  For those who understand things better visually...

  

  

  

  But then, of course, knowing it is one thing and perfectly executing it is another, though... LOL

• AnaNikolaj 639 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:37 AM

  pmm711:

  As for wind speed, wind direction and stuff…it’s definitely all random.  I’ve played other TCs, and winds have ranged from 1-2mph up to the nutty 45mph ones.

  That's only true in coin rooms and those games, where you could used to invite friends to 9 holers by just clicking on their name... But when you choose stroke, MP or alt and set it in scored mode, then the conditions are always set to the highest tier default, exactly the same as it was in flash. 

• AnaNikolaj 639 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:40 AM

  MioKontic:

  I don't know what the green speed would be for the final rounds of the VUSO now as I don't play it, but if it is the same as TC's are playing day in day out it's rather unfair on all other tiers who aren't able to do that.

   

  Yep. A TL has zero chance of ever playing on anything faster than 13, apart from VUSO, when they are thrown into the deep end... 

• MioKontic 4,654 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:48 AM

  AnaNikolaj:

  Yep. A TL has zero chance of ever playing on anything faster than 13, apart from VUSO, when they are thrown into the deep end... 

  Not strictly true, the weekly Nation tournament has 14 speed greens for TL tier.  But I didn't know there is now 14.5 also.  So is there an even higher speed for the final rounds of the VUSO, e.g. 15?

• MioKontic 4,654 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 9:59 AM

  Just to add a little info to what PMM and Simon have said, and to correct what the OP says in the link HP provided...

  With higher speed greens particularly, if you have a severe downhill putt (e.g. St Andrews #2, both hole locations, Oakmont #2, top hole location, Bethpage #15, bottom hole location, Wolf Creek #3, and a number of others), you have to hit the ball extremely softly.  Because you have hit it softly it is travelling slowly, therefore giving it every chance to still drop in the hole, but if it misses it can still go 10-15ft by or more.  So where the OP in that thread says that it would not go in if more than 5.5ft past the hole, that's not exactly true - it depends on the distance it would go past AND the speed of the ball.

• SimonTheBeetle 3,645 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 10:45 AM

  MioKontic:

  With higher speed greens particularly, if you have a severe downhill putt (e.g. St Andrews #2, both hole locations, Oakmont #2, top hole location, Bethpage #15, bottom hole location, Wolf Creek #3, and a number of others), you have to hit the ball extremely softly.  Because you have hit it softly it is travelling slowly, therefore giving it every chance to still drop in the hole, but if it misses it can still go 10-15ft by or more.  So where the OP in that thread says that it would not go in if more than 5.5ft past the hole, that's not exactly true - it depends on the distance it would go past AND the speed of the ball.

  You just made a very good point here, Mio.

  If you look at the images I provided above, note that I only applied about 55% of the suggested power, almost just the half because otherwise, on that adorable hole of Merion, it would roll down way past the hole, out of the green if missed.

• Yiannis1970 3,307 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 11:49 AM

  MioKontic:

  AnaNikolaj:

  Yep. A TL has zero chance of ever playing on anything faster than 13, apart from VUSO, when they are thrown into the deep end... 

  Not strictly true, the weekly Nation tournament has 14 speed greens for TL tier.  But I didn't know there is now 14.5 also.  So is there an even higher speed for the final rounds of the VUSO, e.g. 15?

   

  Actually, these numbers are meaningless in correlation to those that we were playing on flash for years. Now 13 speed is like 10 on flash...on the launcher you need to bang everything nowadays. Flash was all finesse on 13-14 greens....now, you just bang and the ball hardly moves.

   

• Yiannis1970 3,307 Posts

  Tue, Aug 1 2023 11:51 AM

  SimonTheBeetle:

  MioKontic:

  With higher speed greens particularly, if you have a severe downhill putt (e.g. St Andrews #2, both hole locations, Oakmont #2, top hole location, Bethpage #15, bottom hole location, Wolf Creek #3, and a number of others), you have to hit the ball extremely softly.  Because you have hit it softly it is travelling slowly, therefore giving it every chance to still drop in the hole, but if it misses it can still go 10-15ft by or more.  So where the OP in that thread says that it would not go in if more than 5.5ft past the hole, that's not exactly true - it depends on the distance it would go past AND the speed of the ball.

  You just made a very good point here, Mio.

  If you look at the images I provided above, note that I only applied about 55% of the suggested power, almost just the half because otherwise, on that adorable hole of Merion, it would roll down way past the hole, out of the green if missed.

   

  Have used this gimmick for a little while Simon, 9 out of 10 times, the proper speed is about there (50-55%).