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A better interface (+ retire or improve autocaddy)

• PRStevenson 842 Posts

  Sat, Oct 25 2014 12:41 AM

  Please, please, please could WGT improve or get rid of autocaddy. What a major improvement that would be to the game.

  The current one is blimmin' useless and should have retired a long time ago. Always selecting the wrong club, giving you the wrong putting increment etc.

  Perhaps it was a labour of love that the developers feel too attached to let him go. But if something that's supposed to be helpful is really poor and more of a hindrance to players, IMHO their priority should be in making changes which will improve the game even if that means simplifying.

  My suggestion (as has also been suggested before me) is that he doesn't need to be replaced with a new autocaddy.

  Actually there doesn't need to be a club pre-selected per shot. A player can easily discern which club they would select from the bag.

  So instead creating a simple step system without him would be better.

  Below is an example of a cleaner looking and slightly improved interface...

  Club, Swing, Spin, Distance

  Default is blank. Players can't take a shot without first going through these steps (which is what most players do now anyway). 

  Step 1 - Select Club

  Step 2 - Select Swing (which automatically calculates distance)

  Step 3 - Apply Spin on Ball

  

  Upon selecting a club the word 'club' would change to that club type (with graphic) as currently displayed in the game. 

  Swing would behave exactly the same as it does now and would affect distance which has been moved to the right side of the swing meter.

  As you can see the golf ball (being step 3) has been logically placed as the third selection on the left side and would behave exactly the same.

   

   

• CerinoDevoti 3,232 Posts

  Sat, Oct 25 2014 8:01 AM

  You have to keep new players in mind. Some have never played Golf IRL so the auto-caddy does help in the learning process. Also is shows some club distances. I don't bother to know exactly how far each club hits by name(5i, 8i etc), I just use the caddy to show me possible distances ratings.

  A simple on/off choice could be the compromise position instead of a complete interface change IMO.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Sat, Oct 25 2014 8:10 AM

  I think it's brilliant. I would love to see that as simplified as shown. The on/off caddie switch could be defaulted to on to take care of new players. And it doesn't look like it would be hard to do. 

• PRStevenson 842 Posts

  Sat, Oct 25 2014 11:27 PM

  YankeeJim:

  I think it's brilliant. I would love to see that as simplified as shown.

  Thanks YJ

  CerinoDevoti:

  You have to keep new players in mind. Some have never played Golf IRL so the auto-caddy does help in the learning process. Also is shows some club distances. I don't bother to know exactly how far each club hits by name(5i, 8i etc), I just use the caddy to show me possible distances ratings.

  A simple on/off choice could be the compromise position instead of a complete interface change IMO.

  Thanks CD, I have kept new players in mind. I'm not suggesting removing the tutorials but retiring the in-game auto-caddy from pre-club selection who does more harm than good.

  Please have a look at the OP again. This new interface would show club distances in the same way. I think it's simpler, cleaner looking interface and it tackles the auto-caddy problem.

• divotdigga 406 Posts

  Sun, Oct 26 2014 2:31 AM

  Seems to me an all round improvement to the visuals without taking away any of the 'help' from those who wish to make use of it.

  Perfect solution.

  A new crisper look would be welcome.

  divotdigga

• andyson 6,415 Posts

  Sun, Oct 26 2014 8:41 AM

  I applaud you PRS for taking the time and making the effort to put together a mock-up of a no auto-caddy user interface.

  Seeing the image my first thought was "If I haven't selected a club, why am I holding one?"  Perhaps this is the way it should look?

  

  Waiting on a club selection.

  I also wondered if branded clubs and balls would fit in the left side. So I did a mock-up with clubs selected and a branded ball.

  

  They will fit if the ball brand name is moved to the right side of the ball.  However the pop-ups for club selection and shot type will need to be repositioned on the window.   As well as the Mr. Ledbetter's slide out advice.

  I take exception to moving the club yardage.  When selecting a club or shot type, I look at the yardage just below the pop-up.  I can see both the club selected and the yardage without looking elsewhere.  In the proposed design, I can no longer do that.  Depending on window size the yardage is now 8 or 9 inches to the far right of the screen.  I fear I'll need to look back and forth from yards to clubs or from shot type to yards to make sure I have it right.

  Putter scale goes with the yardage I assume, its linked now.  So that gets repositioned as well.

  However the proposed new design does not have room on the left for yardage unless the meter gets moved to the right.  That could possibly mess up the meter performance.  (as in WGT changing anything has that possibility.)  For sure, moving the meter would require user overlays, and Putter/Shot Pal changes.

  All that being said, those are not the biggest problem faced changing the User Interface.  Keep in mind the game has been around 6 years.  There are hundreds of thousands of active players who have hit at a minimum of 10s of thousands of shots (someone with a 60 avg and 2000 ranked rounds has hit 60,000 shots if all 9 hole rounds, 2000 x 30)  Our minds, eyes and hands have been conditioned to go where the spin dot is, where the club selection is, where the ding line is, etc.

  It will be uncomfortable.  There will be massive complaining on the forum.  LOL  Any change by WGT gets complaints.

  I think the guiding principle here needs to be minimize the changes to the User Interface.  Everything in its normal, game play conditioned, position.  Something like this:

  

  Once a club is selected using the current pop-up then swing type and yardage appear.  All following displays and locations are exactly the same as before.  I'd suggest all woods and irons default to FULL shot.  Putter, since auto caddy is disabled, defaults to a user selected setting based on the putter in the bag.

  I think this minimizes both changes to the WGT code and changes to the user.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Sun, Oct 26 2014 9:35 AM

  andyson:

  I think this minimizes both changes to the WGT code and changes to the user.

  Not sure what kind of hassle it would be but if there was a simple on/off button to toggle between what it is now and what it could be there wouldn't be an issue. I really like the idea of having to know what you want instead of it being suggested to you. Would sharpen a few games, I would bet. 

• PRStevenson 842 Posts

  Sun, Oct 26 2014 11:52 PM

  Thanks andson, this was a great help...

  andyson:

  Seeing the image my first thought was "If I haven't selected a club, why am I holding one?"  Perhaps this is the way it should look?

  I had exactly the same thought, I just didn't get around to doing a mock-up of the pose. BTW, I think the one you've done looks great!

  Thanks also for doing the brand mock-up. I think it works well

  andyson:

  Depending on window size the yardage is now 8 or 9 inches to the far right of the screen.  I fear I'll need to look back and forth from yards to clubs or from shot type to yards to make sure I have it right.

  Unless you're operating WGT on a 52' inch Plasma I think the minimal effort involved in looking from left to right of the swing meter shouldn't affect players adversely. Upon selecting 'Swing type' the yardage would automatically adjust and that would be visible at least in the players peripheral vision. I'm certain it would be second-nature to momentarily glance across and check yardage before thinking about ball spin (Step 3). Of course once players have played enough many know the distance of all swings on their clubs from memory.

  Any repositioning would only take minor adjustments. There's no extra information added so in theory, aesthetically it should look the same.

  Your mock-up at the bottom is good or something like this?

  

   

  Step 1 - Select Club - Avatar changes to the swing position - 'CLUB' changes to selected club with brand/graphic.

  Step 2 - Select Swing - ' SWING' changes to the swing type and distance automatically appears above 'YDS' (or 'FT' for putting)

  Step 3 - Select Spin - 'SPIN' changes to 'Ball on tee with center dot' (and brand and hit meter if applicable)

  Final thoughts on this are;

  a) the softglow just highlights those selection/adjustment steps. A non-essential element that I thought I'd just throw out there.

  b) the 'Ball on the tee' could be there instead of 'SPIN'. Having 'SPIN' just keeps it uniform with the pre-selection menu on the other side.

  I'm pretty sure they'd be a general consensus to keep the swing meter in  the center.

  In all examples, having these steps as mandatory for each shot (except putting just 1 & 2) would negate the need for any default selection.

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Oct 27 2014 5:16 AM

  Heh. You two guys are doing a great job of fine tuning something WGT won't even give a second thought to.  :-(

• ApexPC 3,164 Posts

  Mon, Oct 27 2014 7:05 AM