Forums

Just an extemporaneous thought...

• krskfr 458 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 2:05 PM

  maoriand1:

  I understand your words Yiannis but i m not agree. Without knowledge u will not get low scores , spreadsheet or not. I repeat it s not a spreadsheet that make u achieve scores like 54 or 26. Today i play smart with no spreadsheet but i m still not against spreedsheet users.. i learned a lot using a spreadsheet for years because it was not only follow the excel suggestion.. there was always the hope to get always better scores and improuve. Obiuvsly i can only talk about andivo spreadsheet.. i can t judge other players spreadsheet but if it s an excel file it s not wgt that can decide if they can use excel or not. As someone said before the autoding influence directly the game and for obiuvsly reason it s not allowed by wgt. We can talk till next days but it s not the same stuff.

  Mr Yiannis couldn't have expounded on my thought better if i tried.... It's like he and i share a brain or something. Everything he said is my point precisely. Rock on Yiannis!

• Yiannis1970 3,305 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 2:36 PM

  maoriand1:

  "I will never use a spreadsheet or a compass or whatever. I play a game with the best of my ability. If the best of my ability is not enough, i can live with that. Some people can't..." Your msg have no sense. If u want limit yourself everyone should limit his game or he is considered not a skill players like you? 😂😂😂😂

   

  What?

  Write it down in Italian...i don't understand what you are sayin.

   

• Robert1893 7,722 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 2:44 PM

  el3n1:

  But I also find it humorous when people constantly throw out the word "FEEL" as it pertains to a game with zero "tactile" interface other than a mouse and keyboard as it pertains to wind and elevation and slope.

  As I've pointed out to you previously, what I (and I suspect many others) mean by feel is simply intuition. Or maybe a better word is impression. We're not referring to physically feeling something. That intuition or impression is based on experience.
  
  For example, I was playing Pinehurst the other day. It was a par 3 on the back 9 with a slight wind to my back. I've never played that particular par 3 well. As I looked at the shot, I thought "I bet a 6-iron would be perfect." And it just about was. It stopped about 2 feet from the hole. Previously, I had never played the 6 iron on that hole. And I've never mapped my clubs so I wasn't doing any calculations in my head.
  
  In that situation, the club just "felt" like the right club.

• kavvz 2,195 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 3:12 PM

  krskfr:

  kavvz:

  What type of player would y'all classify fmagnets as?   We've all seem him play live, so by feel or not? 

  As and objective observer, taking into account the factors i mentioned who ought to be deemed "truly elite," are those players who play with no aids whatsoever, just memory and trial and error - thus the answer can only be 1 - Fmagnets! He is the best player in this game and it's not particularly close. Stats are stats, but eyeball tests matter too. This dude sometimes doesn't even set up his shot utilizing the reverse angle. Just grips and rips, i highly respect that. Dude is a G! As far as who is top billing with the use of aids, i gotta surmise it to be one YOUNG46... followed by UJJBNJK.

  Do you consider mags' calculator an aid? 

  For the record I'm not guffaw'ing at mags.  He truly is the best on here and I could care less how anyone gets the ball from tee to cup -- unless of course they're actually cheating.  :)

• maoriand1 1,287 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 3:33 PM

  Yiannis1970:

  maoriand1:

  Your msg have no sense. If u want limit yourself everyone should limit his game or he is considered not a skill players like you? 😂😂😂😂

   

  What?

  Write it down in Italian...i don't understand what you are sayin.

   

  on phone i was not able to mentionate your old msg : ""I will never use a spreadsheet or a compass or whatever. I play a game with the best of my ability. If the best of my ability is not enough, i can live with that. Some people can't..." 

  reading this msg it s like if u say i reach a certain level and i can t go over this limit and this is not true because your ability will improuve in the time.. u are not the same players of 4 5 yrs ago. u play better today and u will play better in the time.  there s something weird if a player wants go over his limit and play better , learn the game, learn how to improuve his putting game???  i said your msg has no sense because it s like if u think that all the spreadsheet users are going over their ability thx a spreadsheet and this is absolutely out of the reality. u should try what a spreadsheet is before judge what u don t know. i can judge a spreadsheet player cause i played lot of years with it .. i know about what i m talking.. u don t... u are only making sentences in something it s not different by use a calculator, or make a fast brain calculation.  if u don t know how to putt u can use all the spreadsheet u want u will not get low scores.  

   

   

   

• Yiannis1970 3,305 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 3:53 PM

  maoriand1:

  i said your msg has no sense because it s like if u think that all the spreadsheet users are going over their ability thx a spreadsheet and this is absolutely out of the reality. u should try what a spreadsheet is before judfe what u don t know. i can judge a spreadsheet player because i was one of them time ago .. i know about what i m talking.. u don t

   

  Actually, you don't understand what i am posting and therefore you are confused...

  I denied to use any of these aids for principal reasons and because this game was not meant to be played like that. If this game was meant to be played like that, WGT would provide all these aids to every player.

  You keep talking about irrelevant issues such as if a player can get better or not.

  I was clear on all of my posts that for me using these stuff degrades the whole spirit of the game. I never talked about scores or anything, you did.

  I don't try to convince anyone in here, i am just stating my mind....either way, i don't give a dime to all of those who are using them. I don't consider them good players, only people who use workarounds in order to get the job done using any means.

   

• maoriand1 1,287 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 4:07 PM

  Yiannis1970:

  maoriand1:

  i said your msg has no sense because it s like if u think that all the spreadsheet users are going over their ability thx a spreadsheet and this is absolutely out of the reality. u should try what a spreadsheet is before judfe what u don t know. i can judge a spreadsheet player because i was one of them time ago .. i know about what i m talking.. u don t

   

  Actually, you don't understand what i am posting and therefore you are confused...

  I denied to use any of these aids for principal reasons and because this game was not meant to be played like that. If this game was meant to be played like that, WGT would provide all these aids to every player.

  You keep talking about irrelevant issues such as if a player can get better or not.

  I was clear on all of my posts that for me using these stuff degrades the whole spirit of the game. I never talked about scores or anything, you did.

  I don't try to convince anyone in here, i am just stating my mind....either way, i don't give a dime to all of those who are using them. I don't consider them good players, only people who use workarounds in order to get the job done using any means.

   

  i got u very well yiannis... but u are talking about " the spirit of the game"  or "the game was not meant to be played like that"... are u serious? because if u are serious u lost the last 4 yrs. 

   

• ujjbnjk 2,128 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 4:37 PM

  A feel player is a player that don't use any helps... Purely play off memory and feel and knowing what the clubs do... Not using a spreadsheet or a ruler to aim or a stopwatch to time the dots or a calculator for that matter... Extremely hard to master but far from impossible... Everyone play different it's a game enjoy it as you like as long as you stay inside rules... But yeah it's a huge difference take the tools from a elite player that been using it for years and he won't match a feel player that never use it... Simple as that. 

• Jeff052551 35 Posts

  Fri, Jul 19 2019 8:15 PM

  Let’s look at the pro golfers. Do they play by feel, yes. Do they use calculators, no. Spread sheets, no. Yardage charts for each hole, yes. Green layout cards with the hole locations marked in feet from front, back and sides, yes. Have they mapped their clubs through 100’s of hours on the driving range and in practice, yes. Do they have these club yardages memorized, yes. Do they have a caddy to help with yardage, wind, slopes and landing areas, yes. Do they have a caddy to help line up putts, yes. Even the best of the best play by “feel” but with all the assistance that is allowed by the PGA. I am too old to memorize all my club yardage distances. I can’t play by muscle memory but by a swing gauge. I can’t feel the wind in my face or look at the trees or throw some grass in the air to get a feel for wind strength and angle. I have to gauge putt strength based on percentage of force using different scales (ie, 15-30-60-100 on my putter meter). I am playing a three dimensional sport on a two dimensional screen. So yes some is feel, as much as you can feel on a computer screen. But also with assistance from my club maps and calculator. The only part of the game that no calculator can help you with is putt break. That takes practice and having played the game IRL.

• Yiannis1970 3,305 Posts

  Sat, Jul 20 2019 1:10 AM

  maoriand1:

  i got u very well yiannis... but u are talking about " the spirit of the game"  or "the game was not meant to be played like that"... are u serious? because if u are serious u lost the last 4 yrs. 

   

  I am quite serious, yes. Those who are making use of all these stuff have destroyed an excellent game. Perhaps i lost the last 4 years but you have probably lost the whole idea of this game which is personal ability to play well, have fun and get better.

   

  The only important thing for you and all the others who use all this mambo jumbo nonsense is to be No1 by any means. So, sleep well and be sure that i haven't missed absolutely nothing from what's going on in these last 4-5 years in this game.