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Best of Best 18 holes

• TarheelsRule 5,563 Posts

  Sat, Nov 5 2011 2:04 PM

  I have played the best of 18 holes in stroke play and other formats.

  I'm curious as to what criteria was used to select these as there are a number of these holes that should never be in the best of anything.  A few examples would be the 1st hole at BPB, the 3rd hole at Kiawah.................those 2 aren't even the best of the nines they are on.

  No holes from Oakmont at all and four from St Andrews, 3 of which are pretty weak holes, including the 18th, 11th and the par five on the back, think it is # 14 but not positive.  I can't believe that the 15th at BPB and the 4th at Kiawah are not on this course.  

  I can't recall all the holes but I seem to remember the four from St Andrews, 2 from Kiawah.  Is there a list somewhere that shows the holes that made the course.

• Doublemochaman 2,009 Posts

  Sat, Nov 5 2011 3:26 PM

  Maybe it's time for WGT to come up with the Toughest 18 Holes!  Now that could be fun.

  From Legend tees.

  Championship greens.

  Moderate wind.

  Every level is given a score to beat to prove his/her excellence.

  Play at your own risk (of ego crushification).

• piztaker 5,743 Posts

  Sat, Nov 5 2011 11:05 PM

  They asked us to put forward our favourites. Perhaps these are they.

• TarheelsRule 5,563 Posts

  Sun, Nov 6 2011 9:38 AM

  I guess so Piz but like I said some pretty lame holes in the group.

  I would like to see them take another stab at this with maybe the toughest of WGT or something like that.  I can't imagine the 2nd hole, I think I'm right on the number at Congessional, it is a 240 yard par 3 with a tight bunker left and no green to work with behind the hole.

  Dump a few of the St Andrews holes, the par 3 11th hole just isn't a good hole, there are at least 5 I can think of that are better.

  I would suggest that WGT just reviews and selects these without asking.

• PeterHopper 1,315 Posts

  Sun, Nov 6 2011 12:02 PM

  Lots on Cong and RSG.

  From STA hole 2, 13, and 17.

  Kia 4, 5, and 18 Beth 2, 5 (that's the one that's hard to birdie?, 7 and 15

  Oak 2, and 9 hard pins. And that 299 par 3

  So 13 holes there for starters. Then add holes from Cong and RSG. The par 3 Tar mentions plus the 18th to finish at Cong.

• oppy 286 Posts

  Sun, Nov 6 2011 6:27 PM

  TarheelsRule:

  I have played the best of 18 holes in stroke play and other formats.

  I'm curious as to what criteria was used to select these as there are a number of these holes that should never be in the best of anything.  A few examples would be the 1st hole at BPB, the 3rd hole at Kiawah.................those 2 aren't even the best of the nines they are on.

  No holes from Oakmont at all and four from St Andrews, 3 of which are pretty weak holes, including the 18th, 11th and the par five on the back, think it is # 14 but not positive.  I can't believe that the 15th at BPB and the 4th at Kiawah are not on this course.  

  I can't recall all the holes but I seem to remember the four from St Andrews, 2 from Kiawah.  Is there a list somewhere that shows the holes that made the course.

  You are mostly correct, save for the fact that the 11th and the 14th holes at St. Andrews are two of the great holes in golf. the 11th being the "eden hole," one that has been copied on courses around the world, and the fourteenth, with the famous hell bunker, is praised for its endless routes to the green. And this is a little of topic, but WGT really needs to change the out of bounds for that hole. The hole is almost ruined because you are not allowed to play left of the hell bunker into the adjacent fairway, which is how anybody plays it in real life who doesn't have the distance to carry "hell."

  For bethpage i would like to see 4 and 5. I dont know what 1 and 6 are doing there either. the 15th is not so much great as it is hard, but it could still be a decent choice.

   

• TarheelsRule 5,563 Posts

  Mon, Nov 7 2011 11:10 PM

  I have actually had the opportunity to play St Andrews in real golf.  I just don't see those two holes as best of holes.  The 11th is a very average par 3, especially if the wind isn't blowing a gale into you.  The 14th is interesting in terms of the hell bunker and the alternative fairway but in WGT land, unless you have a 20 mph wind dead into you it is just a par 5 that can be reached without much fanfare.  I understand why 18 is in the grouping, although it is a pretty weak hole and 17 is one of the best holes in golf.

  I agree with you on BPB, 1 is a very weak hole as is 6.  I don't care much for 15, basically a tricked up hole with a horrid green.  Kiawah as I mentioned has some good holes on it but the 3rd isn't one of them.  Not sure why Oakmont was left off to should be in there with at least 3 or 4 holes.

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Tue, Nov 8 2011 1:34 AM

     I think when WGT selected the course by taking the holes we the people wanted, you have to realize the vast majority of those playing don't really know much about the great history of course design. I.E. what makes a great course.

  I am glad they did this compilation though.

  In the future, perhaps they will enlist more knowledgeable folks. Then we could have the addition of truly great holes.

   

  Would I want the 18 hardest?  NO IM talking about the 18 best holes.

• SgtDoodles 3,112 Posts

  Tue, Nov 8 2011 9:55 AM

  My choices would be:

  Par3's - Cong 2, Oak 8, RSG 16, BPB 14.

  Par5's - Oak 12, Cong 6 (I like its #2 position on the Best Of course), BPB 4.

  Par4's - St A 13, St A 17, BPB 7, BPB 15, Kia 4, Kia 18, RSG 9, RSG 18, RSG 4, Oak 3, Oak 5.

  IMO, seeing as Kiawah was WGT's first course it's not up to Best Of standard. Only exception is #4, as it is a peach of a hole. Need more Oak.

• TarheelsRule 5,563 Posts

  Tue, Nov 8 2011 5:14 PM

  Good grouping of holes there SGT

  I would trade out the BPB 14 for Kiawah 17 but you nailed most of the rest in my opinion.

  I think WGT would have been better served by asking the top 10 players on here to put this list together rather than just get a community opinion.