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DISCUSSION: Stats/Score/Ranking Re-set.

• tibbets 1,043 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 3:46 PM

  Nice work on the stats Niv.

• nivlac 2,188 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 3:50 PM

  Thank you, sir.

  Like I said, I didn't want to force any conclusions on anyone, but I think that's a pretty accurate picture of what's going on right now.  Obviously some people got left out who I may not know as well, but all in all I think it'll hold up to the masses and be even more accurate when and if the stats are actually reset.

  http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=rmZUpcD5AQRK54gz4PrkdqQ

  (just moving link to the front)
  

• CaptainCouples 135 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 5:15 PM

  The Spirit of the Game

  Unlike many sports, golf is played, for the most part, without the supervision of a referee or umpire. The game relies on the integrity of the individual to show consideration for other players and to abide by the Rules. All players should conduct themselves in a disciplined manner, demonstrating courtesy and sportsmanship at all times, irrespective of how competitive they may be. This is the spirit of the game of golf.

  Conclusion; Penalties for Breach

  If players follow the guidelines made by WGT, it will make the game more enjoyable for everyone.
  
  If a player consistently disregards these guidelines during a round or over a period of time to the detriment of others, it is recommended that the Committee consider taking appropriate disciplinary action against the offending player. Such action may, for example, include prohibiting play for a limited time on the course or in a certain number of competitions. This is considered to be justifiable in terms of protecting the interest of the majority of golfers who wish to play in accordance with these guidelines.
  
  In the case of a serious breach of Etiquette, the Committee may disqualify a player under the Rules of WGT

  OK enough with the WGT bashing. Its a Game. an on line Game

  In my short time playing this game I have seen many positive improvements to the beta version of WGT golf. I think the people involved need a Big round of applause and a thank you for all of their efforts thus far. The game of golf has evolved over the years and so will this online version. You can not expect it to be perfect right from the word go. I am sure that WGT is doing everything they can make improvements for the future for the better of all players involved. So rather the continue bashing the people involved and their efforts. Give them praise our better yet $17.50 for a brand new set of clubs, so they may afford to spend the time and money to do great things. If thats not possible. Then get out your check book and buy them up. I am sure it's for sale for the right price. Then all the day to day decisions can be yours. And if this is not option for you. Then fill out an application and help them out in that way. But please, if this too is not an option. Put a lid on the public out cry of your dissatisfaction or quit playing so the rest of us may continue to enjoy the game, the new people from all walks of life that we meet while playing, and the friendly competition of on line golfing.

  Thanks for listening:

  Sincerely,

  CaptainCouples

• WGTadmin2 1,152 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 6:25 PM

  Unfortunately reseting is not a simple task without wiping out a lot of progress players have already invested in their characters.  We are definately welcoming suggestions on how to make sure that we reward active players and remove inactive scores.  Generally speaking we did not anticipate such a strong attachment to the AVG Score stat.  The AVG Score stat is actually not very meaningful other than a general indication as to ability.  Career earnings is a far better stat to see who the most competitive players are ranked.  In the future we are looking into implementing a true golf handicapping system to enable players of all skill levels to play together on a more level playing field.

• Caven 63 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 6:27 PM

  Interesting discussion.

  NivLac great job and idea on the ranking and spreadsheet.

  Tibbets, I feel your frustration, and you have every right to feel as you do.  There are but a few of you who have devoted the time, energy, effort, expertise, and most of all heart into this web site.  And I agree, WGT is slow to react to some solid suggestions, patience sometimes gets in the way of passion.

  Cap. Couples, I also can understand where you are coming from and you are correct that WGT has done some good improvements, but is it not the communities responsibility to express where they are not improving?  Is that not what beta is for?  Tibbets and Nivlac and some others have every right to be frustrated and feel exclusion in this process.  I commend these people, unlike myself who has backed off because I no longer find the solace and peace in this game I once did, they keep giving their best.

  There is no right or wrong answers or comments here, what is evident from reading these replies is that there is common purpose, just a difference in how to reach a conclusion.  The best step for WGT now is communication.

• tibbets 1,043 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 6:37 PM

  WGTadmin, make it simple.

  Tell us precisely what would get erased were you to reset the stats, and let US decide.  If you go by the poll that's already out, I'd say the preliminary answer is RESET THE NUMBERS. 

  Why would the statistcs be so deeply embedded in the beta program?  I see that in our profile we have a drop down box that currrently only displays "Career", but is clearly meant to have things like tier, season, etc added to it.  It's obviously your intent to have a different sets of statistics available to the player, so why not just archive these current numbers into a "Season#1" or something of the like and let us start fresh on "Season #2"?

  I really wish you would have told me that it was going to be this difficult a few months ago when I originated this topic.  Perhaps in the interim we could have come up with some other ideas that by now could have been implemented.. Instead, we are at square one simply due to your refusal to be candid about the process involved.  I really hope that you are learning that your lack of transparency is the single largest detriment to the game.  We have all but told you in so many different ways many times over.

  You asked for our suggestions about the tier system before, and the end result was you implemented a system that not one of us suggested.  How did you come to the conclusion that your current tier system was the way to go, because I tell you, it had nothing to do with what we asked you to do.

  I will add that it there is no shame in admitting that you are in over your head with some things.  There are some brilliant people here who have lots of experience in game administration who would be more than happy to consult and help guide you to the aim you seek.  It is clear that the current staff of WGT is not fully equipped to handle some of these issues that have been brought up over the past 8 months, so rather than ask for "suggestions", actually come out and ask for our help in designing the system, and allow those of us that know best to do what we are good at.

  CaptainCouples, everything Caven mentioned to you I second.  Why don't you show your great appreciation for what WGT is doing by actually recording a round at the Bethpage course they worked so hard to put together?

• CaptainCouples 135 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 7:07 PM

  WhaaaH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  Someone get that kid a !@#$%^& Handkerchief while I run to the pro shop snack bar for some more cheese and crackers! Please...

  Find me in the search for players and whine more on my wall if you feel the need and you know who I am typing about.

  Again WGT Admin

  My Thanks for all of your efforts thus far and in the future.

  CC

• tibbets 1,043 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 7:12 PM

  "All players should conduct themselves in a disciplined manner, demonstrating courtesy and sportsmanship at all times, irrespective of how competitive they may be. This is the spirit of the game of golf."

  Does the comment above this one really apply?  Take your own post to heart, and feel free to come back when you have something more constructive to say than "Wahhh".

  Over and out.
  

• Snaike 3,678 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 9:23 PM

  CaptainCouples....  I am appalled.  No, absolutely furious at your attempt to belittle and denigrate the changes that we, as a playing base, are trying to make.

  How dare you try to kiss up to WGT and dismiss everything we are trying to change with a wave of your hand and a thinly veiled stab at those who are trying to change it...

  ... when you, yourself, sir, are EXACTLY the person about whom this complaint started.  How DARE YOU hide your Master / 60.49 rating and then have the unmitigated gall to attack us for trying to make a level playing field.

  Play a ranked round and then come back and voice your opinion.  Until you STOP HIDING you have no say in this at all.

  I have written two more paragraphs, but in the interest of keeping my account open, I have deleted them and decided that discretion is the better part of valor.

  No cheers!

• salamii 1,058 Posts

  Wed, Jun 3 2009 9:45 PM

  snaike, easy pal. CaptainCouples has been a member of WGT for a long time and has earned that avg just as much as those other top masters. Due to unfortunate circumstances he has been unable to play  for over a week. How dare you have the gall to attack him for his opinions. He has the right just as mush as anyone else, including yourself, to have any say at all about the changes that are being made here. What irritates me the most is the fact that you and other new players are crying over these conditions considering that this is the first major change that you have experienced. In my opinion anyone who dosn"t have at least 125 rounds played should just keep their mouths shut and worry about improving their own game.