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Ok WGT

• Miantiao 401 Posts

  Mon, Mar 12 2018 11:24 PM

  Robert1893:

  I bet that sounded a whole lot better in your head. 

  You still don't get it do ya bloke.

  Imagine an homogenised world where being offensive is outlawed. Such a world exists in many countries. 9/11 (RIP the brave and innocent) is a perfect example of what some will do when confronted with ideas that are offensive to personal beliefs or values.

  Should we outlaw critical speech or oratory in order to appease such grubs, or should we stand firm to protect people's rights to offend and be offended?

  In any case, regards VEM, I'm as yet to experience any 'strange' shot that I can't account for. Furthermore, to suggest that VEM adjusts its bandwidth according to recent form is simply preposterous. There is no logic in that whatsoever, and I've yet to see any evidence of such.

  Young46 in his video stated as much, and I have provided the quotes from that video where he says so.

  If you can't wrap your head around that, then there's not much else to say except jog on.

• Robert1893 7,722 Posts

  Tue, Mar 13 2018 10:19 AM

  Miantiao:

  You still don't get it do ya bloke.

  
  
  You missed my point completely. And that's fine because I really don't care anymore if you understand it.
  
  Nevertheless, as an aside, I have a pretty good grasp regarding the ideas of critical speech, free speech, and tolerance. My dissertation revolved around the concept of political tolerance. So, I'm fairly well read on the topics. Indeed, my literature review chapter was 70 pages in length. And yes, I grasped what I was reading. Otherwise, my doctoral committee wouldn't have passed me. :-) 
  
  But you go ahead and carry on... telling me what I don't get and what I can't wrap my head around, when you didn't even grasp the very concept I was talking about.  
  
  After all, you do a wonderful job of responding to what you think people are posting rather than what they actually do post. I suppose it's easier that way.  

• Miantiao 401 Posts

  Tue, Mar 13 2018 2:14 PM

  Robert1893:

  Indeed, my literature review chapter was 70 pages in length. And yes, I grasped what I was reading. Otherwise, my doctoral committee wouldn't have passed me. :-) 

  It strikes me that you needed to research a doctoral degree in order to understand very basic human rights concepts, as outlined in the UN charter for the protection of human rights, some 70 years ago.

  Robert1893:

  when you didn't even grasp the very concept I was talking about.  
  

  And what concept is that? To shut up when others tell you to? To use more subtle,tactful or diplomatic language when addressing others?

  What garbage. If what I have to say is offensive, or insulting to the subjective beliefs or moral sensibilities of those I address, then so be it.

  Perhaps international diplomacy would benefit from unambiguous, simple language instead of conversing in diplomatic platitudes for the sake of being 'polite', or 'civilised'.

• el3n1 4,502 Posts

  Tue, Mar 13 2018 5:11 PM

  borntobesting:

  One thing that everyone seems to ignore is what Chad Nelson AKA MisterWGT has said about VEM. Several times he has stated yes the VEM  patent exsists but it has never been implemented. He went on to say what you are seeing is the normal deviation built into the game. 

  sorry, I had not heard or read that before...but after you mentioned it I did some searches to find the references you were given...during that search I came across this statement by what I believe to be another WGT member in  the know... he stated the text below in this forum thread.  So from what I gather even statements by "MisterWGT" could be elusive in nature without revealing details pertaining certain aspects of game play while still leaving room for other aspects to be influenced by the said parameters.  Like it is stated there is a lot more too it than they can really share without compromising the inner workings of complex algorithms. He could "technically" give an answer that denies VEM used in one aspect of the game while not specifically addressing how it may be used otherwise but the question he answered was not specific enough to pin down the specifics and even if it did there is a way around that.  They are not going to divulge the details which is why it still comes up for debate or discussion sometimes..  

  tibbets 1,043 Posts

  Mon, Jan 25 2010 3:48 PM

   

   

  You won't get a cut and dry answer to that question, not because they are being intentionally elusive, but due to the proprietary nature of the system WGT uses.  No one at WGT is at liberty to discuss in detail the inner workings of that system.  It's like asking the CEO of any corporation to divulge any inner company workings and/or secrets:  It's just not going to happen, as it potentially compromises the integrity of that corporation and leaves them at risk from outside influences.

  One thing that a few people are missing here is that there are complex algorithms in place that determine the outcome of every shot.  There are many different variables involved in those calculations, and the equipment used is only one of them.  It would not necessarily be mutually exclusive to have elements of the VEM system in place and have MisterWGT's answer be true. There's just more to the bigger picture than can be elaborated on and for now that's going to have to be good enough for all of us.

• Robert1893 7,722 Posts

  Wed, Mar 14 2018 2:42 PM

  Miantiao:

  And what concept is that? To shut up when others tell you to? To use more subtle,tactful or diplomatic language when addressing others?

  Twofold. 

  First civility seems a rare commodity today.

  Second, I try to be quick to apologize when I discover that I’ve offended someone.

  That’s it. That’s all I basically argued. And I never suggested my approach should be a universal norm. At least I don’t recall saying that it should be. If I did, I retract that statement. And I certainly never told you or anyone else to shut up. So, I’m not sure where that came from. 

  Be well and hit ‘em straight and seldom. 

• Miantiao 401 Posts

  Sat, Mar 17 2018 9:15 PM

  Robert1893:

  I try to be quick to apologize when I discover that I’ve offended someone.

  Context...

  Robert1893:

  And I certainly never told you or anyone else to shut up.

  Implied...

  Robert1893:

  Be well and hit ‘em straight and seldom. 

  Cheers, you too.

  Mike

• Swartzman 34 Posts

  Sat, Dec 17 2022 5:58 AM

  There is most certainly "randomness" to these shots.  I continue to experience the same things over and over.  It is almost as though I don't want to "ding" the center line as, quite frankly, EVERY time I do, the results are much less than stellar.  Prime example:  wind 2-5 from the east, green is same altitude as fairway, hit a perfect shot with proper club distance, off to the right, short and in the bunker.  It is almost impossible to "guage" what will be a good shot, a stellar shot or a complete bomb.  Setting all things up allowing for windage, yardage, elevation, etc., it is pretty much a shot in the dark.

• ct690911 7,205 Posts

  Mon, Dec 19 2022 12:21 PM

  Swartzman:

  There is most certainly "randomness" to these shots.  I continue to experience the same things over and over.  It is almost as though I don't want to "ding" the center line as, quite frankly, EVERY time I do, the results are much less than stellar.  Prime example:  wind 2-5 from the east, green is same altitude as fairway, hit a perfect shot with proper club distance, off to the right, short and in the bunker.  It is almost impossible to "guage" what will be a good shot, a stellar shot or a complete bomb.  Setting all things up allowing for windage, yardage, elevation, etc., it is pretty much a shot in the dark.

  I feel your pain, but using starter clubs means that "randomness" is built in.  You are an 82 avg Pro.  Once you obtain better equipment and gain some experience, you will probably find that your dinged shots are more accurate.

  ct