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Faster greens than Champion in normal rounds

• lonniescott711 4,206 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 3:50 PM

  lonniescott711:

  In the cc settings there`s a green speed after champ  super fast . How much faster is this setting than champ speed ? If not that much faster maybe it could be the new speed . Off to my cc for a 24 hr, round on Kiawah to see .

  Super Fast is the next green speed after champion in the cc settings . Its showing 20 which is ridiculous . You pretty much will be using the lowest putter increment when putting . Between it and Ultra Fast both are like putting on glass and using on sloped greens would be a definite no go .

   

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 7:33 PM

  Robert1893:

  Third, I know how fast the greens are that I putt on. It's not that difficult to extrapolate from that to knowing how fast championship greens are.

  This is where you're wrong. You can't use a formula to compute momentum and that's what does inexperienced putters in. The faster greens are more than an increase in a stimp number, you have to know how to play downhill rolls. Go play Oakmont or Merion with true 13 greens and you'll see. There's a whole lot more to it than just multiplying by a factor of something.

• Robert1893 7,719 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 7:49 PM

  YankeeJim:

   This is where you're wrong. You can't use a formula to compute momentum and that's what does inexperienced putters in. The faster greens are more than an increase in a stimp number, you have to know how to play downhill rolls.

  
  You seem to be making my point for me. Moreover, I didn't say that one point was the only reason why I felt comfortable offering an opinion on the matter.

   

  YankeeJim:

  Go play Oakmont or Merion with true 13 greens and you'll see. There's a whole lot more to it than just multiplying by a factor of something.

  
  I have played both wth championship greens. I'm not sure why you're making this about me. I just shared my opinion that championship greens are fast enough. And one of the reasons that I staked out the position that I did was because I had played a couple of courses with championship greens, as I noted.

   

   

• BMX123 631 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 8:07 PM

  x

• Robert1893 7,719 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 8:17 PM

  On another site, I had seen that video posted. Those greens are unbelievable. 

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 8:59 PM

  Robert1893:

  I have played both wth championship greens. I'm not sure why you're making this about me. I just shared my opinion that championship greens are fast enough.

  This is not about you, it's about me understanding how you can come from where you're coming from without the experience. A few rounds is not experience. 

• Vaibhav5viv 886 Posts

  Sun, Oct 30 2016 9:42 PM

  Robert1893:

  Sure. And then what happens you potentially end up with a situation like Shinnecock Hills. See below. You could end up with a course that becomes unfair and is more of a test of luck than skill.
  
  While luck always plays a bit of a role, the idea is to minimize its effect. In my opinion, faster championship greens will increase the role that luck plays without placing a greater emphasis on skill. 
  
  http://www.golfchannel.com/media/2004-us-open-shinnecock/ 

  Need more US Opens set up like this.

• Robert1893 7,719 Posts

  Mon, Oct 31 2016 5:57 AM

  YankeeJim:

  This is not about you, it's about me understanding how you can come from where you're coming from without the experience. A few rounds is not experience. 

  
  
  OK. Then let me ask a few simple questions. They're simple questions because I'm a simple man. In an earlier post, you stated:

  "The faster greens are more than an increase in a stimp number, you have to know how to play downhill rolls. Go play Oakmont or Merion with true 13 greens and you'll see. "

  After  doing that, what do you think I'll conclude? Do you think I'll conclude that:

  a) Championship greens need to be faster;

  or

  b) Championship greens are fast enough as they are.

  And how many rounds do I need to play to develop an informed opinion on the speed of championship greens? Obviously, you think the number of rounds I've played is too few. OK, fine. So what's the number of rounds needed to have an informed opinion on the speed of championship greens?

• YankeeJim 25,827 Posts

  Mon, Oct 31 2016 9:03 AM

  Robert1893:

  So what's the number of rounds needed to have an informed opinion on the speed of championship greens?

  Simple. Get to the tier that uses them and face them daily. I have no idea what you'll conclude when you do but I'm espousing they be faster for Champions than for TLs. 

  This was how WGT introduced the green speeds back in 2010, before the TL and Champion tiers were created. The TL tier created the 13 speeds today but nothing was added when the Champion tier was introduced. Logic says it should have been bumped to 14.

  Tier          Green Speed Stimpmetered

  Hack               7.9

  Amateur         7.9

  Pro                  9.0

  Tour Pro         10.0

  Master            10.0

  Tour Master    11.0

  Legend            12.0

• Robert1893 7,719 Posts

  Mon, Oct 31 2016 9:09 AM

  YankeeJim:

  This was how WGT introduced the green speeds back in 2010, before the TL and Champion tiers were created. The TL tier created the 13 speeds today but nothing was added when the Champion tier was introduced. Logic says it should have been bumped to 14.

  
  
  Fair enough. That makes sense.
  
  Be well.