Forums

Chambers Bay

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 2:44 PM

  This has to be  one of those agree to disagree issues..I throughly read all the info  I could find about Chambers from the arch blog to Tom Doak's website(IMHO,perhaps the best modern traditional arch in the world today) To  the blogs at golf atlas .com.

  I'm saying it is commendable to say the least about what this design group is trying to create here.

  There giving a true nod to the strategic elements of a GREAT DESIGN!

  I for one  loved reading about the implementation of this course.

  About all the mining..Well get over it. Do you think St Andrews would have been different if they had the land moving equipment we have today? You know it would. For every "traditional authentic links course" created that would even be considered world class, there were another 10 that are crap  from a design standpoint..

  I for one am totally  thrilled about this compelling design.

   

• oppy 286 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 2:49 PM

  danohi50:

  This has to be  one of those agree to disagree issues..I throughly read all the info  I could find about Chambers from the arch blog to Tom Doak's website(IMHO,perhaps the best modern traditional arch in the world today) To  the blogs at golf atlas .com.

  I'm saying it is commendable to say the least about what this design group is trying to create here.

  There giving a true nod to the strategic elements of a GREAT DESIGN!

  I for one  loved reading about the implementation of this course.

  About all the mining..Well get over it. Do you think St Andrews would have been different if they had the land moving equipment we have today? You know it would. For every "traditional authentic links course" created that would even be considered world class, there were another 10 that are crap  from a design standpoint..

  I for one am totally  thrilled about this compelling design.

   

  The point is that they didnt have the technology we have today is what makes a course like St. Andrews all the more impressive that it is in the top 5 of the world rankings to this day.  I am for one am not thrilled about a course like Chambers Bay. But as you say, it must just be a matter of opinion.

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:00 PM

  Lets face it...most of the courses on the worlds top 100 tracts were all created before1935 explains quality of available plots of land for a great course today and the prevailing design philosophy of that time was to find the course in the plot of land.

  Tom Doak did a very incredible job at Bandon Dunes of trying to find the course. Ben Crenshaw with his partner also did the same with there sand hills course. All these guys have done a wonderful job of bucking todays design traditions. It looks like Chambers Bay may be close to this same category..Ive also heard from a good source, that the Lido GC in N.J. may also be rebuilt to its former glory. This course was destroyed for a navy shipyard before ww2.

• JLadenburg 19 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:08 PM

  Look here for an independant review of the course:http://pnwgolfreview.com/2009/05/26/chambers-bay/

  or check the Chambers Bay website for many more.  It's not my opinion, it's the opinion of real experts.  I can't find one bad opinion.

   

   

• oppy 286 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:13 PM

  danohi50:

  Lets face it...most of the courses on the worlds top 100 tracts were all created before1935 explains quality of available plots of land for a great course today and the prevailing design philosophy of that time was to find the course in the plot of land.

  Tom Doak did a very incredible job at Bandon Dunes of trying to find the course. Ben Crenshaw with his partner also did the same with there sand hills course. All these guys have done a wonderful job of bucking todays design traditions. It looks like Chambers Bay may be close to this same category..Ive also heard from a good source, that the Lido GC in N.J. may also be rebuilt to its former glory. This course was destroyed for a navy shipyard before ww2.

  It is true that alot of the great land to build golf courses on has been used. But that is why more and more courses are being built overseas, where there is still excellent land to build golf courses on that is yet to be found.

  As for these American "links courses," I am sure you know by now I am not a big fan of them. There other great new courses I admire like Muirfield Village, Sand Hills (more of a Shinnecock than a Bandon Dunes),  and Valhalla just to name a couple.

  I know of Lido Golf Club (which is on long island, NY by the way) It is only 40 minutes from me so that would be great if this happened, i here that it used to rival National, and Shinnecock. Do you have any other info you could share about this possible restoration?

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:16 PM

  I will try to look into it for you. Would you try golf atlas for me..Ill look around in some other obscure places. Glad to have some people to discuss design with, its fun for me.

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:21 PM

  Ask any golfer to recite the names of America's greatest courses, and the chances are good you'll hear "Pebble Beach", "Pine Valley", "Augusta National", "Oakland Hills", "Oakmont", and "Crystal Downs", among others. What you won't hear, are names such as "Timber Point", "Pomonok", "Gibson Island", "Mill Road Farm" and "The Lido". The reason is because these courses no longer exist, the sad result of the Great Depression, World War II, urban expansion or suburban sprawl. In their heyday, though, they were something special to see and play. Former Masters champion and renowned golf instructor Claude Harmon once called The Lido -- designed by architect Charles Blair Macdonald -- "the greatest course ever". High praise from the long-time head professional at world-famous Winged Foot Country Club. But there were other great courses that have since disappeared, many designed by notable architects such as Alister MacKenzie, Seth Raynor, A.W. Tillinghast, William Flynn and Devereux Emmet. Thanks to Daniel Wexler's exhaustive research, these missing masterpieces can While it’s hard to imagine that famed Pebble Beach Golf Links would ever be dug up and turned into a residential community, similar fates have happened to other great courses in the past. Thankfully, due to the exhaustive research of Daniel Wexler, the full details on 27 of these exceptional layouts can be found in The Missing Links: America’s Greatest Lost Golf Courses & Holes. Through the use of period photographs and detailed maps, Wexler takes the reader on a hole-by-hole guided tour of some of the most famous courses—designed by some of America’s most famous architects—that no longer exist. Alister MacKenzie’s Sharp Park GC in California (washed away in a Pacific storm), William Langford’s Key West GC in Florida (destroyed by a hurricane), and Charles Blair Macdonald’s Lido Club (sold to developers during the Depression) are but three of the classic courses that can be “played” once more. Introduction 7 (6) AMERICA'S GREATEST LOST GOLF COURSES Charles Banks Westhampton CC (Oneck) - Westhampton, NY 13 (8) Billy Bell & George Thomas El Caballero CC - Tarzana, CA 21 (4) Also by Billy Bell 25 (4) Charles H. Alison Timber Point GC - Great River, NY 29 (8) Devereux Emmet Meadowbrook Hunt Club - Westbury, NY 37 (4) Pomonok CC - Flushing, NY 41 (4) Also by Devereux Emmet 45 (6) William Flynn Boca Raton Resort & Club (South) - Boca Raton, FL 51 (6) Mill Road Farm CC - Lake Forest, IL 57 (6) Yorktown GC - Yorktown, VA 63 (4) Also by William Flynn 67 (4) William Langford Key West GC - Key West, FL 71 (6) Charles Blair Macdonald & Seth Raynor Deepdale GC - Great Neck, NY 77 (6) Gibson Island CC - Gibson Island, MD 83 (6) The Lido GC - Lido Beach, NY 89 (6) The Links GC - Roslyn, NY 95 (4) Shinnecock Hills GC - Southampton, NY 99 (4) Also by Charles Blair Macdonald 103 (4) Dr. Alister MacKenzie Bayside Links - Bayside, NY 107 (6) Sharp Park GC - Pacifica, CA 113 (6) Seth Raynor Oakland GC - Bayside, NY 119 (4) Also by Seth Raynor 123 (4) Donald Ross Englewood GC - Englewood, NJ 127 (4) Pinehurst Resort & CC (Number Four) - Pinehurst, NC 131 (5) Also by Donald Ross 136 (7) George C. Thomas Fox Hills GC - Culver City, CA 143 (3) Also by George C. Thomas 146 (3) A. W. Tillinghast Beaver Tail GC - Jamestown, RI 149 (6) Fresh Meadow CC - Flushing, NY 155 (6) Norwood CC - West Long Branch, NJ 161 (4) St. Albans CC - St. Albans, NY 165 (4) St Petersburg CC - St Petersburg, FL 169 (4) Also by A.W. Tillinghast 173 (4) Captain H.C. Tippett Montauk Downs GC - Montauk, NY 177 (6) Willie Watson & Sam Whiting The Olympic Club (Ocean) - San Francisco, CA 183 (4) NINE ADDITIONAL LOST COURSES OF HISTORIC NOTE 187 (23) APPENDIXES A) America's Greatest Lost Holes, etc. 202 (8) B) Metropolitan area maps 210 A 1985 graduate of Middlebury College, Daniel Wexler is a former golf professional turned historian, and one of America’s leading experts on the classic architects and designs of golf’s Golden Age. He currently resides in the Los Angeles area and may be contacted at Midd23@aol.com.

  

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:37 PM

  Still looking for any info on the Lido...It could be my  informant was full of  crap..if your ever in long island gang look it up and report back here..I'm truly interested.

• oppy 286 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:44 PM

  I found the same thing in my search. That is was once considered on the best courses in the world. People said that every hole had great risk reward options. It was mainly a CB Mcdonald course, but like PVGC it had many other of the best architects consulting with him to design the course. I also found out about a man named Mike Keiser who desired to recreate lido to its former glory, but i think he is dead now.

• danohi50 1,020 Posts

  Mon, Nov 30 2009 3:48 PM

  Ok,  thats the info i was looking for..bummer..

  Check out this natural pic of Chambers

  http://boulderbanner.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/11.jpg